Climate changing in Chile

General topics related to Living in Chile
Post Reply
User avatar
41southchile
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:39 pm
Location: Lakes Region

Climate changing in Chile

Post by 41southchile » Tue Mar 19, 2019 9:31 am

As I drove past lake Llanquihue this morning thinking how low it was, (haven't seen it that low since the big drought in 2015) I heard an interesting interview on the radio with a climate expert from one of the universities in Santiago .
He was saying that Santiago has had below average rainfall for the last 10 years where they used to have an average of about 300 mm per year, the last decade they have rarely had more than 200mm, although it did point out that 10 years is not a long time to draw new conclusions at the moment its known as a mega drought (many years of below average rainfall) for it to be considered a new normal it has to be an average of over 30 years.
He mentioned that the zonal central sur, Temuco to Puerto Montt now typically has nearly 30 percent less rain fall annually now than it did 30 years ago, although with about 1000 mm it is no where as critical as the central valley areas.
He was mentioning this as apparantly Chile is in an el Niño situation at the moment and the science says that this means more rainfall, which the central valley badly needs, so this year there us a possibility of more rain, although after that he also said the last e Niño in Chile failed to bring above average rainfall in fact there was a deficit that year too.
Chile , like many countries has a lot of challenges to face up to regarding water and is going to have to invest a lot in being more efficient and looking for new water supplies, I've heard a figure that there are 400000 people in Chile that do not have a reliable water source.
I remember in the 2015 drought the municipal in Puero Montt was spending over 100 million pesos a month for about 5 months, in trucking water to families that didn't have water as their springs or creeks had dried up, there was also a dry winter in 2016 where they were doing the same. There is a lot of new rural water supply projects going on around the region it seems, people can't rely on what the used in the past anymore here.
By the way Santiago has had zero rainfall this year and Puerto Montt, well we are still getting warm days in the early 20s and have had nearly 60 percent less rainfall than a normal year to date. I think it was about 90 mm of rain ytd the other day when I looked, and most of that has probably fallen in about three rainfall events.
Comuna Loncotoro Lakes Region Chile

scandinavian
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 345
Joined: Tue Sep 21, 2010 5:55 pm

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by scandinavian » Tue Mar 19, 2019 10:01 am

Yes, last year was pretty dry in Santiago. However, no rain so far this year is pretty standard. Average in the last 30 years is 3.9mm to date. I am not going to worry about that yet. 2017 wasn't that bad. I remember hoping that the drought was over, but unfortunately it doesn't seem so.
check https://climatologia.meteochile.gob.cl/
It has the totals for each year for each station. Interesting.

User avatar
41southchile
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:39 pm
Location: Lakes Region

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by 41southchile » Tue Mar 19, 2019 10:51 am

scandinavian wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 10:01 am
Yes, last year was pretty dry in Santiago. However, no rain so far this year is pretty standard. Average in the last 30 years is 3.9mm to date. I am not going to worry about that yet. 2017 wasn't that bad. I remember hoping that the drought was over, but unfortunately it doesn't seem so.
check https://climatologia.meteochile.gob.cl/
It has the totals for each year for each station. Interesting.
Interesting thanks, found some interesting stuff,
although not that user friendly or I'm not a very good user? On the traditional meteochile site it shows Puerto Montt has now had exactly 100.0 mm of rain as of 9am today a 54 percent deficit.
Yeah not that unusual that Stgo hasnt had any rain yet considering the small amount in a normal year. I remember back in 1995 when I was here on high school Exchange on an easter trip to Santiago how stinking hot it was and dry, everyone was saying it was earthquake weather, whatever earthquake weather is?🤔
Yeah 2017 was the only year here in the sur that the annual rainfall has reached he longterm average on meteochile, in the 7 years I have been watching it, every other year was at least a 10 percent deficit and up to 50 percent one year I think
Comuna Loncotoro Lakes Region Chile

User avatar
41southchile
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:39 pm
Location: Lakes Region

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by 41southchile » Tue Mar 19, 2019 11:04 am

scandinavian wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 10:01 am
Yes, last year was pretty dry in Santiago. However, no rain so far this year is pretty standard. Average in the last 30 years is 3.9mm to date. I am not going to worry about that yet. 2017 wasn't that bad. I remember hoping that the drought was over, but unfortunately it doesn't seem so.
check https://climatologia.meteochile.gob.cl/
It has the totals for each year for each station. Interesting.
Actually now i am getting the hang of that site, thanks for that , interesting. I did notice though a few years ago the meteochile changed their long term average for PM from 1800 mm per year to 1500 mm, due to the drop off in rainfall. Also interesting to note that for a supposedly wet city , PM in the last 10 years (I didn't go back further) has never had more than 68 mm in one 24 hour period, and that was an outlier most of the other years were about 40mm. For a city with a wet reputation that's actually not that much, in NZ it's common to get 100 mm in a 24 hour period . The wet south of Chile is as much a myth as soggy wet England. https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-47620228
Comuna Loncotoro Lakes Region Chile

User avatar
41southchile
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:39 pm
Location: Lakes Region

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by 41southchile » Tue Mar 19, 2019 11:13 am

Right sorry to keep going on, I find weather very interesting, one observation I have noticed here in the South over the last four or five years is how often the forecasts over estimate how much rain we are going to get . Ive hardly ever seen an underestimate I don't think, maybe once or twice, but the majority of times they will say 30 mm is go in to fall and we will get 10 or 15, sometimes they will say 5 or 10 and we will get 1 etc etc. Maybe they need to look at some of their computer models and make adjustments.
Right, off outside now in this bright sunny day, that was forecast yesterday to have 5 or 6 mm of rain for today.
Comuna Loncotoro Lakes Region Chile

Britkid
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 1740
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2012 6:59 pm
Location: Talagante area, Chile
Contact:

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by Britkid » Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:30 pm

It hasn't rained this year where I live in the south of the metropolitan region, or if it was has it must have been a tiny amount overnight. However, we had some rain in November this time or even early December if I recall so it doesn't feel like a prolonged drought this year.

I've only lived here from 2014 to this year. The summer it has averaged 1 day of rained per year. At a guess the winter rains have got less or stayed the same.

There is a lake at Aculeo del Paine in the central region of Chile that was a lovely lake at the start of this decade, but during the decade steadily dried out. Now it is completely dry in summer and with a very small amount in winter. There are people that have camp grounds and hotels and attractions on the shore of a lake that no longer exists.

I do think we will likely get some more rainy years at some point, but the overall trend may be for changing climate including rainfall patterns. At a casual glance north and central Chile might have more of an issue with changing rainfall patterns than the south, but it's not always as obvious as all that.

User avatar
41southchile
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:39 pm
Location: Lakes Region

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by 41southchile » Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:33 pm

So here's an article about connecting 73 families to a new supply system with a deep well.
Just at first glance it seems a lot, 510 million pesos, but being government there will be a lot of bureaucratic costs and administration etc etc .
Approx 7 million per family, there should be some savings on scale if the government is doing this. I guess it is what it is, and assuming this is an average cost and people do need water and Chile is now in a position to provide this to it's citizens. Rough calculations assuming there 150 thousand families without reliable water in Chile to connect them all at this cost (it maybe higher in other areas) , Chile will need to budget 1.6 billion USD to connect them, this is assuming more families don't need water as wells dry up in some areas and not counting any maintenance and replacement of current systems in use as they need to be replaced.
But I guess that's not as high as what I thought, it's definatly possible. But it's billions of dollars in the years ahead just to sort out the current situation and assuming the country doesn't get a lot drier.
One thing they should be doing especially in the zona central is piping all those agriculture canals, and moving away from flood irrigating , they are losing an astronomical amount of water through evaporation and leakage , the initial costs maybe high but the savings of precious water in the years ahead will more than cover it and if they do it right everyone will have pressurised water on their properties, canal and ditch irrigation is being replaced by pipes around the world, I haven't heard if there is a plan to do this here yet. As people around the world are learning it's about using water more efficiently to avert crisis in the decades ahead.
https://www.soychile.cl/Puerto-Montt/So ... rural.aspx
Comuna Loncotoro Lakes Region Chile

User avatar
admin
Site Admin
Posts: 17890
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 11:02 pm
Location: Frutillar, Chile
Contact:

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by admin » Wed Mar 20, 2019 7:22 am

pretty close on your calculation. the government is looking at opening up concessions to the private sector for rain water collection and because there is about a 1.7 billion dollar deficit in investment in the sector:

https://www.df.cl/noticias/empresas/mop ... 71805.html
Spencer Global Chile: Legal, relocation, and Investment assistance in Chile.
For more information visit: https://www.spencerglobal.com

From USA and outside Chile dial 1-917-727-5985 (U.S.), in Chile dial 65 2 42 1024 or by cell 747 97974.

User avatar
41southchile
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:39 pm
Location: Lakes Region

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by 41southchile » Thu Mar 21, 2019 8:36 am

Britkid wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:30 pm
It hasn't rained this year where I live in the south of the metropolitan region, or if it was has it must have been a tiny amount overnight. However, we had some rain in November this time or even early December if I recall so it doesn't feel like a prolonged drought this year.

I've only lived here from 2014 to this year. The summer it has averaged 1 day of rained per year. At a guess the winter rains have got less or stayed the same.

There is a lake at Aculeo del Paine in the central region of Chile that was a lovely lake at the start of this decade, but during the decade steadily dried out. Now it is completely dry in summer and with a very small amount in winter. There are people that have camp grounds and hotels and attractions on the shore of a lake that no longer exists.

I do think we will likely get some more rainy years at some point, but the overall trend may be for changing climate including rainfall patterns. At a casual glance north and central Chile might have more of an issue with changing rainfall patterns than the south, but it's not always as obvious as all that.
Britkid , I wonder if international journalists read the forum to get story ideas, more than once I've seen people talk about things here then they pop up in English media, although this was too soon after was talked about here so just a coincidence as the guy quoted there has been in the media lately here too.
Just like the fisheries resources are being pillaged its same with water, then everyone seems all surprised when there is nothing left, and suddenly realise in hindsight the way they were doing wasn't sustainable, we humans are great at that, hindsight never there when you need it I guess.
Here's la laguna you we're talking about the other day

https://news.yahoo.com/drought-wipes-po ... 37813.html
Comuna Loncotoro Lakes Region Chile

User avatar
admin
Site Admin
Posts: 17890
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 11:02 pm
Location: Frutillar, Chile
Contact:

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by admin » Thu Mar 21, 2019 11:05 am

More than a few "chile writers" and "chile experts", read the forum and publish articles. in fact it has been going on for so long, i don't even pay all that much attention to it anymore.
Spencer Global Chile: Legal, relocation, and Investment assistance in Chile.
For more information visit: https://www.spencerglobal.com

From USA and outside Chile dial 1-917-727-5985 (U.S.), in Chile dial 65 2 42 1024 or by cell 747 97974.

Britkid
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 1740
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2012 6:59 pm
Location: Talagante area, Chile
Contact:

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by Britkid » Thu Mar 21, 2019 11:59 am

Water use is another subject that has not been presented well to the public. What annoys me is when people talk about water saving measures like certain types of shower heads, taking shorter showers, and not leaving the tap running while cleaning teeth, while ignoring bigger issues.

Watering the lawn in a 5000 sq metre parcela uses far more water.

Avocados also use a lot of water.

Meat production is horrendous. As a vegetarian, you can leave the taps permanently on and still use less water (indirectly) than a big meat eater. If you look up the claimed numbers for amount of water used for one hamburger, it's so high it's hard to even believe at first. But just think about how much water is needed to grow crops. Now, consider that on average you have to feed 10 kilos of crops to an animal to get 1 kilo of meat. So, the water consumption of meat is already 10x higher before you even factor in the animals' own drinking, and water needed to run the farm.

The whole of residential water consumption, is actually quite a small portion of the total.

Regarding the dried up lake of Aculeo de Paine, I saw a facebook post a year or two ago when someone had taken a photo of the area from above, circled the gardens that had green grass at the end of summer, and was trying to shame and humiliate the people to stop watering their lawn all summer while the lake was drying out. He was saying he lets his grass die in the summer, and that's what everyone should do.

I wonder if this will become more of an issue in central Chile in the coming years. I water our lawn all summer but I honestly don't know if this is something we should be looking at or not.

Britkid
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 1740
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2012 6:59 pm
Location: Talagante area, Chile
Contact:

Re: Climate changing in Chile

Post by Britkid » Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:09 pm

Someone from Vallenar told me that they don't have private swimming pools in parcelas like they do in Chile.

I'm guessing they don't have grass in private parcelas either in the north?. And if not, what is the real reason? Is it because culturally it's not an accepted thing, or because the water would be too expensive to make it affordable even for rich people, or is it just banned by law in those northern desert areas to water the grass.

Perhaps someone from the north has an idea on this.

Post Reply