New Zealand

Anything at all (keep it clean) goes here that does not fit in to any of the other forums.

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Julito
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New Zealand

Post by Julito » Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:07 am


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Re: New Zealand

Post by HybridAmbassador » Mon Mar 18, 2019 1:27 pm

Julito beware, someone will be tellin' you, shame on you. Do not post anything relating to mosque killer, thus NZ the place where happened.
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Re: New Zealand

Post by admin » Mon Mar 18, 2019 2:55 pm

HybridAmbassador wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 1:27 pm
Julito beware, someone will be tellin' you, shame on you. Do not post anything relating to mosque killer, thus NZ the place where happened.

HybridAmbassador, your spammy, trolling, disruptive posts have had you on more than just probation for a while now.

i have one conclusion from your recent posts: you are activly trying to undermine the functioning of this forum; but, that attempt to link that video, put you on way more than just probation. you are lucky you still have an account.

knock it off.
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Re: New Zealand

Post by 41southchile » Mon Mar 18, 2019 3:33 pm

Hybid, you seen like a smart person, can you not see how offensive to so many people that video was?.
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Re: New Zealand

Post by Julito » Mon Mar 18, 2019 4:15 pm

" I think a lot of people will look around now in Christchurch and maybe think a little bit differently now."
Well said 41.... As one who takes people as I find them regardless of colour, creed or country, I´m still in a bit of a fug over it all.

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Re: New Zealand

Post by HybridAmbassador » Mon Mar 18, 2019 4:18 pm

admin, very well. back when a Japanese journalist was beheaded by that soul less Brit converted to Muslim video I posted, you said, I will permit it because he forewarned everyone of cruelty of the video. This time another tragedy struck but not in the US nor in middle east but happened in peaceful New Zealand. I wanted to everyone to know that this type of atrocious crime is happening everywhere. I found that video filmed by the killer himself on the world-wide web. I wanted everyone to know that this tragedy is happening even in NZ and could sometime may even happens in Chile as well. I forewarned every one of this video then posted it, as I did with that Muslim beheading that journalist ... I didn't know that I was on probation by you, if I was, you should have warned me by sending me a message prior.
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Re: New Zealand

Post by Space Cat » Mon Mar 18, 2019 6:15 pm

While I found interesting the insights about NZ above, this is a forum about freakin' CHILE and you keep posting about other countries and obsessing about the actions of Chinese government.

If I want to know world news, I go to Reddit or whatever news site. I come to this forum to learn more about Chile.

By the way, mass murders happen every week around the world. A significant part of them is done by the Western governments who bomb civilians or support local dictators. But nobody cares about brown people without residency in a first world country.

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Re: New Zealand

Post by admin » Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:09 pm

HybridAmbassador wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 4:18 pm
admin, very well. back when a Japanese journalist was beheaded by that soul less Brit converted to Muslim video I posted, you said, I will permit it because he forewarned everyone of cruelty of the video. This time another tragedy struck but not in the US nor in middle east but happened in peaceful New Zealand. I wanted to everyone to know that this type of atrocious crime is happening everywhere. I found that video filmed by the killer himself on the world-wide web. I wanted everyone to know that this tragedy is happening even in NZ and could sometime may even happens in Chile as well. I forewarned every one of this video then posted it, as I did with that Muslim beheading that journalist ... I didn't know that I was on probation by you, if I was, you should have warned me by sending me a message prior.
O.k., I get that. You did not really have any bad intentions tied to it.

Check with me first next time, if anyone has anything that blatantly or even mildly offensive to well, whomever.

With the political b.s. tied to this video in particular, I don't want the forum associated with it. Not really the reason this forum exists, especially when there is a billion other websites that specialize in dealing with that sort of thing, both good and bad.

I am not even remotely worried about the legal implications of it. Think the New Zealand government is really just trying to spook everyone in to not sharing it, for whatever local politics they are dealing with right now. I kind of get that too. They got to get a handle on the social issues this whole thing caused, to stop it from leading to another incident.

What these subjects can do is effect our ranking and usability of the forum. It also can seriously turn-off people that are looking for basic information on Chile. Not exactly the page title I want popping to the top of Google when people search for Chile, or the first thing they see when they open the forum.

I never watched the video. I have seen way too many hours of footage of mass killings. I have been to Auschwitz. I have been to wounded knee. I have seen mass graves in central america. I have seen all the battlefields in between, all over the World. My minor in history was related to dictators, human rights violations, and holocausts.

I don't need to watch another one to tell you how it ends. They all end the same. They all have the same plot. It is Humans doing really horrible things to other Humans.

That is not what this website is about.
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Re: New Zealand

Post by Britkid » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:12 pm

Regarding the post about racism in New Zealand, I am sure the post was accurate. But the killer in this case I believe was actually an Australian living in New Zealand, as perhaps you know.

I think the map above is (broadly) accurate. Many people, I think millions, died in Congo in the late 90s and early 2000s in wars and related issues and it got very little coverage.

One thing that interests me is that, globally, 150,000 or 200,000 people die each day. Even if we take the most extreme tragedy I can think of in recent times, in terms of number of deaths, which is the Boxing Day Tsunami of 2004, which killed about 200,000 people (mostly in Indonesia), all that meant was that we had in 1 day the number of deaths we would normally see every 2 or at most 3 days.

Of course, many of those people are dying of old age, but a quite significant number of them are being killed by cancer, preventable diseases, air pollution, global warming, car accidents, and others. At least a few thousand people a day are killed by each of these thing which when combined are in the tens of thousands.

What that means is that, even on the day of the Christchurch attack, even on that one day, more people were killed by each of the above things than terrorism. By far. I just googled car accidents and the first result said 3000 per day. Global warming is a similar number. The numbers for cancer and air pollution are higher. On the timescale of a year, of an average day, each of these things kill hundreds or thousands of times more people than terrorism.

And yet terrorism dominates the news and governments response. There are some reasons behind it, since terrorism kills in a more horrifying and immediate way, and has a big impact of creating fear beyond the initial attack. But, this seems to be largely emotional rather than rational.

It makes total sense the way the government and people have responded to this. I'm not trying to be disrespectful to the people that have died here. I'm sure such arguments are of little comfort to the relatives, or the dead. The response to this has mostly been spot on.

I just wish that people would also have a similar response to the things that are killing us more silently and less dramatically.

I tried to work out the number of people killed by global warming from flights from Heathrow airport (London's biggest) every day and that is just one airport in one country. My estimate was probably between 1 and 100 people are killed by flights from Heathrow each day. Imagine if all of those people were blowing up to bits in the airport. We would do something about that pretty damn fast.

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Re: New Zealand

Post by 41southchile » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:47 pm

Britkid wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:12 pm
Regarding the post about racism in New Zealand, I am sure the post was accurate. But the killer in this case I believe was actually an Australian living in New Zealand, as perhaps you know.

I think the map above is (broadly) accurate. Many people, I think millions, died in Congo in the late 90s and early 2000s in wars and related issues and it got very little coverage.

One thing that interests me is that, globally, 150,000 or 200,000 people die each day. Even if we take the most extreme tragedy I can think of in recent times, in terms of number of deaths, which is the Boxing Day Tsunami of 2004, which killed about 200,000 people (mostly in Indonesia), all that meant was that we had in 1 day the number of deaths we would normally see every 2 or at most 3 days.

Of course, many of those people are dying of old age, but a quite significant number of them are being killed by cancer, preventable diseases, air pollution, global warming, car accidents, and others. At least a few thousand people a day are killed by each of these thing which when combined are in the tens of thousands.

What that means is that, even on the day of the Christchurch attack, even on that one day, more people were killed by each of the above things than terrorism. By far. I just googled car accidents and the first result said 3000 per day. Global warming is a similar number. The numbers for cancer and air pollution are higher. On the timescale of a year, of an average day, each of these things kill hundreds or thousands of times more people than terrorism.

And yet terrorism dominates the news and governments response. There are some reasons behind it, since terrorism kills in a more horrifying and immediate way, and has a big impact of creating fear beyond the initial attack. But, this seems to be largely emotional rather than rational.

It makes total sense the way the government and people have responded to this. I'm not trying to be disrespectful to the people that have died here. I'm sure such arguments are of little comfort to the relatives, or the dead. The response to this has mostly been spot on.

I just wish that people would also have a similar response to the things that are killing us more silently and less dramatically.

I tried to work out the number of people killed by global warming from flights from Heathrow airport (London's biggest) every day and that is just one airport in one country. My estimate was probably between 1 and 100 people are killed by flights from Heathrow each day. Imagine if all of those people were blowing up to bits in the airport. We would do something about that pretty damn fast.
All good points, it's just not in our nature or processing capacity or whatever . Out of sight out of mind ?
What did S talin say ? One death is a tragedy 1 million is a statistic.
I think Adam Smith in theory of moral sentiments, had something to say about it too, which is often misquoted on, in fact so have quite a few thinkers and scholars throughout the ages.
Yeah I know he was an Australian, but the point was in some ways many NZers had been deluding themselves as to how open and tolerant they may have been . So it took a tragedy like this for people to actually report a blatant n asi insulation company , up until Thursday no one really cared about this , https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christ ... -shootings

How about how loose the gun laws in NZ were, we liked to feel morally superior to the US and their gun problems all the while never actually realizing what was going on while we focused on the supposed non existant I slamic tereorists.
The question also is why would an Australian do this in NZ and not in Aus ? Judging by his planning (which by all accounts had been going on for years) probably because he was unable to get those weapons in Australia but he knew NZ had some of the most relaxed gun laws in the western world outside if the US. It's also pretty obvious he has had outside help after all his travelling around Europe.
As I said before I am not running NZ down for the hell of it, it's just that NZ wasn't actually some wonderful and tolerant place , its just that so many people wore blinkers on and were sleep walking through what was happening around them .
I still remember as if it happened last week, a couple of days after nine eleven with a couple of Chilean friends in McDonalds in a small south island city in NZ, we were talking in Spanish to each other, when a couple of goons came up and started screaming in our faces to "shut the f up you effing #$#$ f off back to your own country now, look what you $&#& have done in America get the F out of here before you get knocked out". Now it now looks like many people in NZ may have finally woken up. https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christ ... ch-attacks
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Re: New Zealand

Post by Julito » Mon Mar 18, 2019 10:50 pm

I can only agree 41. As an Australian he went to the most culturally similar country to access the weapons he knew he couldn´t buy in Australia. They were bought back and turned into scrap by the government (the owners were fully compensated) and then banned in Australia after the Port Arthur massacre. Google it those who´ve never heard of it.
It was Australia´s big wake up call when it came to military firearms being freely available to civilians. I was a soldier for 6 years and can´t think of any reason a civilian apart from specialised police could ever justify the need to possess a semi-automatic of any calibre. They were only ever designed for one purpose and it wasn´t hunting, nor was it target shooting.

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Re: New Zealand

Post by Britkid » Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:17 pm

He actually explained in his online manifesto (which does appear to have been written by him, although I haven't seen verification 100%) why he went to New Zealand (although his reasons are vague). Of course, there is some debate about whether the written manifesto is a genuine representation of his views or whether it's trolling.There is some trolling/jokes in it, but I think it was mostly probably his true views.

One interesting aspect of the story of how he was in an online community for people with similar views and posted there with them, and this possibly egged him on to commit the attack.

______________________________________________________

Why did you choose New Zealand as a place to attack?

New Zealand was not the original choice for attack, I only arrived to New Zealand to live temporarily whilst I planned and trained, but I soon found out that New Zealand was as target rich of an environment as anywhere else in the West. Secondly an attack in New Zealand would bring to attention the truth of the assault on our civilization, that no where in the world was safe, the invaders were in all of our lands, even in the remotest areas of the world and that there was no where left to go that was safe and free from mass immigration.

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