chile's migration crisis

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tiagoabner
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by tiagoabner » Tue May 28, 2019 8:49 am

Non-paywall link to the article: https://outline.com/U2NAXD

Lowering the growth rates will be good, but the true reason why immigrants aren't really integrated with the Chilean banking and credit card system is because they can't.

Due to the way the Chilean banking system is setup, you can only get a real account after getting permanent residency, roughly two years after getting to the country. It could be faster, but bureaucracy and residence visa processing times are a thing. Meanwhile, you can only get a real bank account if you work for a company that has agreements with a bank, which isn't the case for the majority of immigrants. Since they don't have access to credit, they get in the habit of saving to purchase what they need on cash.

It's no wonder they aren't as quick as Chileans to dip into credit: they simply cannot do it.

As an anecdote: when I was out of the country, I moved to Portugal for work and I stayed there for about six months. I opened a full-fledged bank account on day 1, and it included credit lines and a credit card. They had no issue with accepting a letter from my bank manager, a bank statement and my last tax return as proof of income. Yeah, I showed them that I wasn't a random broke guy, but the point is that the was a built-in mechanism for you to get integrated in the banking system.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by admin » Tue May 28, 2019 10:36 am

yea, if you are going to have a massive influx of migrants, don't make them stand around doing nothing. that is just pure trouble for everyone.

i noticed as soon as the residences started getting aproved from the amnesty last year, most of the haitens disappeared in puerto montt or at least you dont see dozens of them selling candy bars on a single intersection anymore. i think a lot of them left for other parts of chile, but a lot more simply went and found a job now that they have work permits.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by tiagoabner » Tue May 28, 2019 11:50 am

I wonder who's interested in keeping things as they are. Given how large the influx of immigrants has been, there should've been some politics viewing it as an opportunity to nurture a future generation of voters. I'm not sure if it's simply inaction, or if there is an underlying cause for not keeping things up-to-date with the rest of the world.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by 41southchile » Tue May 28, 2019 12:35 pm

tiagoabner wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 11:50 am
I wonder who's interested in keeping things as they are. Given how large the influx of immigrants has been, there should've been some politics viewing it as an opportunity to nurture a future generation of voters. I'm not sure if it's simply inaction, or if there is an underlying cause for not keeping things up-to-date with the rest of the world.
How do you mean keeping things up to date with the rest of the world? But yeah that's part of it, Chiles crappy immigration rules were quite outdated , when no one gave Chile a second thought that was fine.
When it was suddenly a place people wanted to move to for whatever reason then the slow bureaucracy collapsed along the way people smugglers and empressarios, politicos etc. all took advantage of the situation.
When countries are doing well economically people want to move there.
Politicos on the right love it as it can cover sluggish economic growth, with more economic activity from new comers, by picking and choosing the right types, no shortage of able immigrants wanting to come in. Politicos on the left love it because the can buy new voters with bonos and promises by opening the immigration gates
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by fraggle092 » Tue May 28, 2019 2:03 pm

tiagoabner wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 11:50 am
I wonder who's interested in keeping things as they are.
All the enchufados who batten off the current system. Why change a good thing? Good for them, that is.
tiagoabner wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 11:50 am
Given how large the influx of immigrants has been, there should've been some politics viewing it as an opportunity to nurture a future generation of voters.
This was already brought up some years ago on this forum even while the Bachelet administration was allowing this backdoor immigration to go on. No doubt the Socialists are assiduously working along those lines, after all it was a Socialist government that let them in. There may be some lingering indebtedness there to capitalize on. Probably see a lot more activity once the immigrants transition to full residency with voting rights.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by eeuunikkeiexpat » Tue May 28, 2019 4:37 pm

fraggle092 wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 2:03 pm
tiagoabner wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 11:50 am
Given how large the influx of immigrants has been, there should've been some politics viewing it as an opportunity to nurture a future generation of voters.
This was already brought up some years ago on this forum even while the Bachelet administration was allowing this backdoor immigration to go on. No doubt the Socialists are assiduously working along those lines, after all it was a Socialist government that let them in. There may be some lingering indebtedness there to capitalize on. Probably see a lot more activity once the immigrants transition to full residency with voting rights.
Back in the early days of the campaigning for the 2018 election, this ethnic gringo PD saw the Frente Amplio type campaigners on the streets of San Antonio talking to Haitians who obviously had a ways to go before ever being able to vote. They paid no attention at all to this non-white but not black immigrant walking the same streets.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by tiagoabner » Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:04 pm

Any thought on this news article?

https://www.biobiochile.cl/noticias/nac ... ivia.shtml

It seems these guys are spreading anti-Haitian propaganda in Valdivia. Not sure how effective that would be in terms of affecting immigration - most likely not at all - but I'm kind of surprised. I always thought Chileans were more of the passive-aggressive types.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by Gloria » Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:31 pm

Fake news.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by eeuunikkeiexpat » Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:53 pm

The neo-Nazi types historically have been of the poblaciones de Santiago and Valparaiso. Imprisionment of their leaders decades back kind of killed their movement. The idiocy of the Chilean left and their enablers of the Chilean business cheap labor (capitalism is good) right have probably insured the renovation of this reactionary segment.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by Gloria » Tue Jun 18, 2019 9:11 pm

tiagoabner wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:04 pm
Any thought on this news article?

https://www.biobiochile.cl/noticias/nac ... ivia.shtml

It seems these guys are spreading anti-Haitian propaganda in Valdivia. Not sure how effective that would be in terms of affecting immigration - most likely not at all - but I'm kind of surprised. I always thought Chileans were more of the passive-aggressive types.
Would anybody dare to make any comments in a world of contradictions and hypocrisy where the right to express yourself is constantly oppressed and labeled as discriminatory, xenophobic or racist. Not matter what you do or say, in favor or against especially in immigration issues will always be considered offensive and in some cases even "inhuman" by the general public however behind closed doors is completely different. Freedom of speech is gone forever? or probably never existed? And because of it, little groups are raising their voices of discontent.Chile was not ready for this unfortunately invasion. Chile´s a poor nation. In Santiago are trying to "keep up with the Joneses" in the meantime in towns and small cities there are 1000´s of families without homes, electricity or basic necessities, health institutions are "dead on arrival" and the list goes on and on and the gov. is giving priorities to the avalanche of poor, unskilled immigrants that are paying zero taxes and taking advantage of chilean "benefits" haitians in particular. They are not even capable of learning the hosting country´s language and interpreters have to be hired or demanding that some institutions learn "creole"....that´s what´s called to have big balls.....and speaking of balls they are already procreating like rabbits.....and for that reason chileans are pissed beyond comprehension. Some are saying in public...." they are human just like us"... behind doors.."but don´t bring them to my neighborhood". Immigration will not be affected, correct but at least the flow was slowed down due to Piñera...thank you Mr President.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by tiagoabner » Tue Jun 18, 2019 10:42 pm

My impression is that there's a much greater lashback on Haitians when compared to other immigrants, such as Venezuelans. The Chilenos I've talked to always mention them not integrating with Chilean society, but there's always an undercurrent of racism.

Of course, this is an anecdotal case and it presumably doesn't reflect how everyone feels about this topic, but that's what I saw thus far.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Post by eeuunikkeiexpat » Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:56 am

tiagoabner wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 10:42 pm
My impression is that there's a much greater lashback on Haitians when compared to other immigrants, such as Venezuelans. The Chilenos I've talked to always mention them not integrating with Chilean society, but there's always an undercurrent of racism.

Of course, this is an anecdotal case and it presumably doesn't reflect how everyone feels about this topic, but that's what I saw thus far.
NO shit, this is Chile. Remember, I am not white, but after dealing with covert to overt USA style BS which could be bodily harming or deadly depending... vs. passive-aggressive Chile ignorance type BS, I'll take the Chile version any day. Chileans have actually changed A LOT in the two decades I've been here. Lot less ignorant and more discerning than before. I myself am surprised at such a rapid change. BUT, the attempt to change the genetic appearance of street Chile in less than a decade while ignoring the possible backlash is STOOPID beyond belief unless conflict is exactly what TPTB wanted to generate.
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