Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

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marti
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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by marti » Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:23 am

...
La mitad de eficaz. El doble de caro. El triple de complicado. Un país de cuarto.

frozen-north
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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by frozen-north » Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:26 am

bert.douglas wrote:

Pollution by law (and in practice with readily available instruments) is measured in "parts per million"
In 1966, the first emission test cycle was enacted in the State of California measuring tailpipe emissions in PPM (parts per million).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vehicle_emissions_control
That far back?
After the Beatles released the Rubber Soul album at the end of 1965, they recorded their follow up album Revolver then embarked on a world tour.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Beatles_in_1966

frozen-north
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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by frozen-north » Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:43 am

After posting I realized that there is a distinction that could be made when describing vehicle emissions as compared to the topic of air pollution, but I found no references to any measurements of PM in grams/kilometer or grams/mile, and you had not provided any either. Also the topic had been covering both, not just vehicle emissions. Even searching now I found only one reference to grams/mile. I am not even sure if it makes sense to describe it this way.

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marti
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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by marti » Fri Jul 03, 2015 12:01 pm

...
La mitad de eficaz. El doble de caro. El triple de complicado. Un país de cuarto.

frozen-north
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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by frozen-north » Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:08 pm

marti wrote:
Since you can't comprehend the use of grams/mile or g/km as the long-established standard
Why is it not expressed in grams for a certain amount of fuel? ...grams/liter? grams/gallon? Why in grams per mile/km?
Some surveys say that trucks idle anywhere from 6-8 hours a day for as many as 250 to 300 days each year.

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marti
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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by marti » Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:43 pm

...
La mitad de eficaz. El doble de caro. El triple de complicado. Un país de cuarto.

john
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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by john » Fri Jul 03, 2015 4:24 pm

The acerbic one has risen from the emissions. :)
One must care about a world one will not see.
--- Bertrand Russell

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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by HybridAmbassador » Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:25 pm

john wrote:The acerbic one has risen from the emissions. :)
ha,ha,haa... Lemon juice is acerbic..Nice quote, harsh or severe, but he is back..!
HybridAmbassador. Toyota Hybrid system for helping climate change.

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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by jamie_m » Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:34 pm

he's back alright !

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Dosedmonkey
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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by Dosedmonkey » Fri Jul 03, 2015 8:49 pm

grams per mile is super weird in my head, as it is a mix of metric and imperial measurements, but does apparently exsist. Grams per km make more sense.

Ounce per mile, sounds odd haha.

Grams per Km is a completely different thing then PPM btw. PPM only tells you what percentage of one cube of exhaust is pollutants. Grams per Km tells you how much pollutant is created for every Km travelled. Its the same as measuring it in Miles per gallon, or Km per litre, when comparing between different vehicles effects on the environment. As we presume all readings are taken using near identical fuel.

Grams per litre would tell you how environmentally friendly a fuel type was, but not the car. As different cars use different amounts of fuel. One that burns more will obviously create more exhaust, and as such more pollution.

Not sure what the sulphur (SOx emission) levels are in fuel in Chile, this heavily effects the environment.
Nitrogen oxides (Nox) levels are are more related to condition of engine, and if the spares used are real, or cheap copies.

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fraggle092
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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by fraggle092 » Sat Jul 04, 2015 1:11 pm

Hasta 1.000 UTM podrían tener que pagar vecinos de la Comunidad Ecológica de Peñalolén, sorprendidos ayer por la seremi de Salud usando leña.
Padre Gatica....

http://diario.elmercurio.com/2015/07/04 ... ACDD7938C0}
Bienvenidos a Chaqueteo City.

Après moi, le déluge

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Re: Santiasco Air Quality a la Bei Jing..

Post by frozen-north » Sun Jul 05, 2015 10:58 am

Dosedmonkey wrote:
grams per mile is super weird in my head, as it is a mix of metric and imperial measurements, but does apparently exsist. Grams per km make more sense.
.....
Grams per Km tells you how much pollutant is created for every Km travelled. Its the same as measuring it in Miles per gallon, or Km per litre, when comparing between different vehicles effects on the environment. As we presume all readings are taken using near identical fuel.
.....
Grams per litre would tell you how environmentally friendly a fuel type was, but not the car. As different cars use different amounts of fuel. One that burns more will obviously create more exhaust, and as such more pollution.
......
It still does not make sense to me.

Let's quote what marti had posted:
marti wrote: Do you understand the concept of a unit of "work" ?

I thought not.

This measurement system assesses the "costs" of a unit of "work" - where an amount of pollution is a cost of a unit of productivity.
What unit of productivity?

First, when quoting the pollution generated by a factory nobody measures it in grams per widget produced.

Second, ...Joules are units of work. Where are the units of work in this 'grams per mile' result shown in the tables?

Third. If the engine isn't moving, then what? Obviously there is an assumption made somewhere about how many kilometres the engine has moved. Where did the mileage used for the calculations came from? Is there a reliance on information given by manufacturers about a particular vehicle's mileage per unit of fuel?

- I didn't see any mention of the type of fuel being used, only about 'cars', light-duty trucks', 'heavy-duty trucks'.
- marti did not reply to the question about his earlier claim about large SUVs producing less pollution than Dosedmonkey's small car.
A new report reveals that carmakers routinely manipulate official UN-backed miles/gallons tests...
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/ ... ency-tests

U.S. Fines Automakers Hyundai and Kia for Misstating Mileage
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/04/us/po ... leage.html
The SI unit of work is the joule. ..... The dimensionally equivalent newton-metre .....
Non-SI units of work include the erg, the foot-pound, the foot-poundal, the kilowatt hour, the litre-atmosphere, and the horsepower-hour.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Work_%28physics%29

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