The Damned Issue!

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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by admin » Mon Jul 11, 2011 5:17 pm

This is not about Chile's development, it is about selling electricity to the Argentina grid. This is about the development of Argentina, not Chile. Endesa really does not care in what country they generate their electricity or their revenue. Would be very surprised if any of it makes it to Santiago (which given the distance, will be very little).
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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by California South » Mon Jul 11, 2011 5:30 pm

Fwiw, great debate / discussion throughout this thread. Learning a lot.
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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by nwdiver » Mon Jul 11, 2011 8:00 pm

They put in another pelton for another 100 years ;)
It's all about the wine.

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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by nwdiver » Mon Jul 11, 2011 9:05 pm

patagoniax wrote:
nwdiver wrote:They put in another pelton for another 100 years ;)
The structure of the Coyhaique facility is crumbling, not just the shaft and turbine. Remember, this is chilean concrete.

I have a friend with cabin up the coast of BC, he has a 8.5kw pelton wheel that was installed for a logging camp in 1954, everybody thought he was nuts buying a coastal property up the inlet, until they visit and see what constant free power can do for an isolated homestead. Its much smaller than the one Coyhaique would have but boy is it a simple system.
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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by El Chupacabra » Mon Jul 11, 2011 11:03 pm

Kind of off topic but related to energy production and alternatives. I found this article and thought it was interesting.
http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/05/20/one-clever-plant/

For those who are to lazy to read the article, the short story is basically a plant that sweats diesel fuel has been engineered. It requires no more than sunlight and carbon dioxide. If this is true, this can/will/should change a lot of things.


Edit: while on the topic of energy production, has anyone ever heard of a company called Steorn ltd. and thier ORBO technology?
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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by FrankPintor » Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:05 am

El Chupacabra wrote:Kind of off topic but related to energy production and alternatives. I found this article and thought it was interesting.
http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/05/20/one-clever-plant/

For those who are to lazy to read the article, the short story is basically a plant that sweats diesel fuel has been engineered. It requires no more than sunlight and carbon dioxide. If this is true, this can/will/should change a lot of things.

Edit: while on the topic of energy production, has anyone ever heard of a company called Steorn ltd. and thier ORBO technology?
Yes... there was some furore about them in 2007 or so. Things have become much quieter now... and they've thrown away my registration to view their knowledge base as well :(
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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by rasmataz » Fri Jul 15, 2011 5:41 pm


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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by JHyre » Sat Jul 23, 2011 11:03 am

Tangentially relevant, Chile seems to have some of US approach:

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/ ... vis-hanson

The comment on "80% vs 100%" is dead-on. Was it Voltaire who said the perfect is the enemy of the good? We strive for utopia and create ruin.

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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by rasmataz » Sun Jul 24, 2011 8:35 pm

Not so fast:

http://www.hydroworld.com/index/display ... 75123.html

New allegations made in HidroAysén permitting investigation


Business News Americas - English
July 19, 2011

An official from Chilean geology and mining service Sernageomin has made new allegations of irregularities in the environmental approval process for the controversial 2.75GW HidroAysén hydro project.

María Francisca Falcón, Sernageomin geologist, presented her concerns to the human rights committee of the lower house, which is responsible for an investigation into the approval process of the project, the lower house said in a statement.

Falcón alleges that the content of a memo, named memo 33, sent to environmental evaluation service Conama was not taken into account during the process.

Memo 33 allegedly contained information regarding possible geological risks associated with filling the reservoirs as proposed.

The committee asked for further evidence to be presented in the case.

Last month, Fernando Miranda, regional housing and urbanization service Serviu official and head of the HidroAysén evaluation project for the authority, stated to the committee that his negative report on the urban impact of elements of the project on local town Cochrane was dismissed despite fulfilling Serviu criteria.

HidroAysén was approved by environmental authorities in region XI in early May after an extended permitting process. The EIA for the US$3bn transmission project has yet to be filed.

The project's approval has been met with a wave of nationwide protests, with those opposed to the project arguing that the works would do irreparable harm to land in Patagonia.

HidroAysén argues the scheme is fundamental to Chile's energy security and will save millions of dollars in reduced energy imports.

Chilean generators Endesa Chile and Colbún are behind the US$7bn project.

http://www.bnamericas.com/story.xsql?id ... =I&source=
Copyright 2011 BNamericas.com, Inc.All Rights Reserved
Business News Americas - English

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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by greg~judy » Fri Oct 07, 2011 5:34 am

here we go again...
after a pause for appeal...
away we go, once more into the dam(n) fray...
:|
p~x might be well advised...
in his (d)evolving "disturbances calendar"
to save space for a few future dam(n) protests...
:idea:
Chile court lifts suspension on HidroAysen dam work

SANTIAGO, Oct 6 (Reuters) - A Chilean appeals court lifted a suspension order on Thursday that will allow work to proceed on the $3.5 billion HidroAysen hydropower project, which aims to prevent energy shortages.

The project has been the target of massive protests due to alleged environmental concerns.

The appeals court in the southern city of Puerto Montt had issued the suspension order in June after legal injunctions filed by opponents of the project. The court revoked the suspension order in a ruling published on Thursday and seen by Reuters.

"This appeal sort of maintained Hidroaysen in standby, as environmental authorities had already given the green light to the construction of the power stations," said Carlos Ferruz, an energy analyst with Corpbanca. But approval of the transmission line is still pending-- and may be even trickier to obtain, according to Ferruz.

HidroAysen is a joint venture between leading generator Endesa Chile END.SN and partner Colbun COL.SN, which will comprise five power stations and plans to generate 2,750 megawatts by damming two major rivers.

Chile, the world's top copper producer, is seeking to boost and diversify its power grid to confront rising energy needs and drought-induced energy shortages, which this year prompted the government to reduce voltage to help avoid blackouts.

Only late last month, a massive power blackout disrupted crucial copper mines in Chile and darkened vast swaths of the country.
Things are not what they appear to be: nor are they otherwise.
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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by greg~judy » Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:55 am

Chile Aims to Generate Half of Its Electricity at Hydro Plants

Chile’s government wants to increase the amount of power produced at hydroelectric plants to between 45 percent and 50 percent from 34 percent, said President Sebastian Pinera.

He announced the target in a speech last night as part of a series of measures aimed at improving energy security and bringing down costs, according to a statement posted on the government’s website.
Damn it all (hmmm... maybe so?) - here we go again...!
looks like it's just about that time - to start building more damn dams?
(but just for "energy security" and "reduced costs" of course?)
:idea:
Things are not what they appear to be: nor are they otherwise.
--- Surangama Sutra
“If we want everything to stay as it is, everything will have to change."
--- Giuseppe Tomasi di Lamedusa

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Re: The Damned Issue!

Post by greg~judy » Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:49 am

greg~judy wrote:here we go again...
after a pause for appeal...
away we go, once more into the dam(n) fray...
Chile court lifts suspension on HidroAysen dam work --- 06 oct.
damn - here we go again, (again)...
the judicial wheels have turned slowly (as always)
but as expected(?) the enviro~challenge was rejected
and the Chilean court approves controversial dam project

(all concerned - please design a new "protest calender" for the next few months.)
"With the new announcement tensions have risen again.
A general strike was called for within hours of the court's decision as well as a series of national protests.
As town squares filled up with protesters on Wednesday evening, the political battle remains far from over."

:|
Chile court rules in favour of Patagonia HidroAysen dam ---04 apr.

Chile's Supreme Court has ruled in favour of a multi-billion dollar dam project in Patagonia, in the south of the country.

The court, the highest in the land, rejected an appeal by environmentalist groups who fear it will damage Patagonia's fragile ecosystem.

The project, which involves flooding 6,000 hectares (15,000 acres) of land, still needs government approval.

It has sparked a number of protests, some of them violent.

Court spokesman Jaime Rodriguez said the Supreme Court had rejected seven appeals filed against the HidroAysen project, a joint venture by Spanish-owned energy company Endesa and Chile's Colbun.

The objections ranged from the detrimental effect opponents said it would have on the Laguna San Rafael National Park to the dangers it could pose to the Huemul, an endangered Andean species of the deer family.

The project would involve the building of five dams on two fast-flowing rivers that run into the Pacific - two on the river Baker, and three on the river Pascua.

They would drain lakes in a region that is famous for its rugged beauty - a landscape of glaciers, ice-fields, mountains and fjords.

The government says the dams are essential to meet Chile's growing energy needs.

Final decision

The Supreme Court decision follows a ruling in October 2011 by a lower court, which had also found in favour of the project.

Environmentalists appealed against that decision, taking it to the Supreme Court.

Wednesday's ruling was the last legal hurdle in the way of the project, which would see two major rivers dammed and five power stations built.

The project will, however, still need government approval for the building of a 2,000km-long (1,250 mile-long) transmission line channelling power to the capital, Santiago.

If the government gives its go-ahead to the transmission line, construction work on the project could begin in 2014, and is expected to take around 10 years.

HidroAysen says the project "represents a cost-effective, sustainable, reliable and ecologically viable source of energy".
damns....jpg
damns....jpg (118.64 KiB) Viewed 2805 times
also this...http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... -dam/print
Things are not what they appear to be: nor are they otherwise.
--- Surangama Sutra
“If we want everything to stay as it is, everything will have to change."
--- Giuseppe Tomasi di Lamedusa

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