I am an American who studied in Finland and lives in Chile (that is perhaps obvious). Although it was in the limited context of university I liked what Finland was about. The university (Joensuu in this case now known as the U. of Eastern Finland) wasn't the most high-tech but I got to work as a research assistant and use whatever equipment I needed to. I like Chile too and I like it more now that I live in a modern apartment with all the amenities you describe; I wasn't as fond of it when I was restricted to just a room in an older house. I think both Chile and Finland are a little boring compared to the U.S. but I got used to it and have learned to live more quietly. It really depends on what you want at that point in your life.rocksana wrote:So far I keep thinking Finland works very well. My choices there are somewhat restricted but standards and quality in general , very high.
But we (Finn husband and I), cannot make up our minds whether to stay in Finland or Chile, so Chile is not that bad after all to come into serious consideration!
Have you been to Salvador Brazil? Reminds me some of Valpo. They even elevators. Much scarier and dirtier town than Valpo.marti wrote:And when Valpo doesn't make the news, it's the same old Valpo, where "microbasural" was invented.
Some like 520 of them in the last census.
Valpo is the pisspot of the country.
In all of Latin America, I mean, Letrine America, I have only encountered one city filthier than Valpo, and that was an oil-town in Argentina.
- Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
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I've been in Valpo hundreds of times and never been robbed.marti wrote:roflmaojohn wrote:
And, paradoxically, Valpo is one of the most beautiful cities in the Americas.
The best advice you can give to a prospective visitor to Valpo is not where to eat or when a museum opens, but what to do after they have been robbed.
There is some poetic justice here:
http://www.lanacion.cl/experto-de-la-un ... 21925.html
http://www.lasegunda.com/Noticias/Nacio ... -Humanidad
Patrimonio de la Humanidad, my ass. Cloaca del Hemisferio.
--- Bertrand Russell
I giggle every time when visitors of this forum complain about some "first world problems" in Chile. The country that has 80+ years life expectancy, 3/100k homicide rate, stands at ~#20 in corruption-free ratings and ~#30 for easiness of business.Donnybrook wrote:There is, indeed, no perfect country. You move from one to the other and - once the nostalgia for the last place wears off - you realize that. I think my perfect country would have to contain bits of each of the several places I have lived or, at least, the bits that were there when I lived there. Countries change, we change, each of us looks for different things. My list changes too. I could no longer take a harsh winter with piles of snow, although I have fond memories of a year in New England with its spectacular autumn. I guess the most you can hope for is an OK country, once you have added up all the pros and subtracted the cons. On that score, Chile works well for me but doesn't for everyone and I guess Norway is the same.
You should try to live in Russia or other non-EU post-USSR country where life expectancy is 65 (because of crime, ecology and poor food quality), homicide rate 7-10/100k, corruption and ease of doing business indices are about 130th place. And when you're getting bad service that's not because somebody is too lazy but because (s)he hates you without any serious reason.
I traveled in US and UK but all the "developed" countries are too stressful to live. Too many things happening at the same time.
For me Chile is balanced enough to spend many years here, maybe even life. It's relaxing here.
So, let me propose that urban decay is in every country and Valparaiso maybe Chile's entry into this area.
In New Jersey, to look at a rich state with heavy duty taxes, including personal income tax, one has to visit Newark, Irvington, Trenton, Camden (all competing with East St Louis), to imagine how damn long it may take to rebuild a city or just parts of it; no question that Valpo is a tough nut to crack, more so, if we remember that Chile is, for all urban purposes, a third world country.
I knew and worked in the S. Bronx in the mid 70's, a damn suffocating jungle for those who had to live there. Take a look at "Report From Engine 82'', by Dennis Smith, or the better known "Fort Apache', key works in the urban decay literature. These books described a city in a terrifying spiral where arson (for profit) was king in the '70's. Whole blocks literally erased in matter of weeks, as NYC, just like Newark, moved quickly to remove what was left of beautiful buildings. The Bronx has recovered but its density has diminished. With heavy injections of federal and states funds it is livable and much safer, but it is not the Village.
Camdem, NJ, has not recovered. A good and decent friend, former Army prosecutor, now an urban Legal Aid attorney, told over drinks me that Camden would be tough to rebuilt. He said, "if you have seen photos of Dresden after the war, well, that is the way Camden looks like in many areas".
Newark the largest city in NJ has recovered in some areas but not enough. Tons of money from the state and Uncle Sam have rebuilt some areas, but it remains somewhat unattractive to people with families.
The puzzling irony here is that a number of state capitals in the US are mostly ghettos. Harrisburg, Trenton, Albany, etc.
All over the US, just like in most cities in S/America, drugs, poverty, and violence have destroy neighborhoods and in some cases, cities. Add to that neglect by the central gov't and political corruption, and the mixture is diabolic.
So, it will take time to turn Valpo into what it should be, a livable, safe city. How long? No idea. Lots of money, good planning, good public safety
policies and good municipal administration seem to be essential.
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The first time I was in Valpo, back in the 18880's, I decided the best way to see it would be to spend a week just riding the buses so I did this for three days or so----I would just get on a bus and ride it to the end and then get on the next one. So on this one afternoon I was on this bus serving the southern most hills in Valpo-----Rode it out to the end to where the bus came to the stop in the bus yard and the driver looks at me as I am the only one and I explain, okay but he would be leaving in 15 minutes and I would have to pay again for the ride out----after my 50 pesos are paid out, I have me tiny postage stamp ticket, he has a smoke and about 10 minutes of a soccer game in the dirt with the other drivers and we are off----we are 3 meters out of the the yard and we have passengers and going down this gigantically long and steep heading right for Plaza Sotomayor----I am in the front seat just to the right of the driver and it's not too far and I notice we are hauling ass downhill and not stopping at the paraderos----I mean really fast and I notice the driver pumping the brakes----we are really hauling ass now and it's obvious this is going to end badly-----
SO the driver pulls by some other bus he would ordinarily be working to steal passengers from and this other bus pulls out beyond us somehow and we pull in behind him where we are soon rubbing on his back bumper and coming to a stop-----emergency brakes Valpo style----so we come to a stop more hand signals are exchanged and the other bus departs where by our driver allows our bus to move forward a few meters at a time as he tests the brakes---we stop tightly each time like we are supposed too----finally an old woman complains the bus has no brakes and she wants her money back---the driver quickly interrupts her to say that she, as well as anyone else that wants to get off the bus, can do so but there will be no refunds----staring at his passengers for a good 20 seconds as he waited for anyone to get off-----NO ONE gets off-----we depart again with everything functioning fine----
- Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
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- Location: Another project. Another country. And besides, the wench is dead.,
I understand that some of our readers suffer from short attention spans and difficulty with reading comprehension. If it will keep you amused and suit your personal needs, wishes and limited range of admissible topics, I could plan to move on to commenting on Albanian towns of between 3000 and 19,000 inhabitants, watercraft, insects belonging to order Diptera, wool hats, rear-fanged lizards, Ptolemaic astronomy, cane furniture, 19th century anthropometric studies, hot beverages, deterministic modeling, average pricing for used books which mention Roy Chapman Andrews, and fricative consonants.SCL wrote:
To constantly denigrate and belittle cities, people, and places gets old and revolting pretty quickly.
I have been there once, and was, but never anywhere else.john wrote:I've been in Valpo hundreds of times and never been robbed.
I accept chaos. I'm not sure whether it accepts me.