Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Chile Investment, how to invest in Chile, what to watch out for when investing, economic issues, currency exchange in Chile, and more.
User avatar
tiagoabner
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 1447
Joined: Sat Mar 04, 2017 9:48 am
Location: Concón

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by tiagoabner » Mon Apr 13, 2020 7:40 pm

FrankPintor wrote:
Mon Apr 13, 2020 7:08 pm
I don’t have a US credit card, that’s one reason for the increased fees. They do recalculate the amount while you’re setting up the transaction so you can at least see what they’re doing. However, once you initiate the transfer and it’s too late for you to change, they will change the delivery date from “next day” to 3-4 days in the future so they can earn interest on the sequestered money for a few days, ahem I mean for “security reasons”. I’ve only made about 4 transfers with them and both the fee increase and the sequestering of the funds have happened every single time.
M
Was that sending money to Chile or to Argentina? I have used them for over two years and I never had that kind of issue, my funds always get to me in 2 business days. Argentina does have monetary controls, though, so that might explain the delays.
I'm NOT your lawyer, accountant or financial planner. All information at this post should be considered for your entertainment only. Consult a professional before making a decision regarding whatever topic was mentioned in this post.

User avatar
FrankPintor
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 1362
Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2007 4:53 pm
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by FrankPintor » Mon Apr 13, 2020 7:59 pm

tiagoabner wrote:
Mon Apr 13, 2020 7:40 pm
FrankPintor wrote:
Mon Apr 13, 2020 7:08 pm
I don’t have a US credit card, that’s one reason for the increased fees. They do recalculate the amount while you’re setting up the transaction so you can at least see what they’re doing. However, once you initiate the transfer and it’s too late for you to change, they will change the delivery date from “next day” to 3-4 days in the future so they can earn interest on the sequestered money for a few days, ahem I mean for “security reasons”. I’ve only made about 4 transfers with them and both the fee increase and the sequestering of the funds have happened every single time.
M
Was that sending money to Chile or to Argentina? I have used them for over two years and I never had that kind of issue, my funds always get to me in 2 business days. Argentina does have monetary controls, though, so that might explain the delays.
I’ve sent money to different places, but not to Argentina. Today I set up a transfer to Banco Estado in Chile with funds I had already uploaded to Transferwise, they overcharged as usual, and moved the delivery date out to April 17. It’s really very poor.
Caracas es Caracas. Lo demás es monte y culebra!

Britkid
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 2330
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2012 6:59 pm
Location: Talagante area, Chile
Contact:

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by Britkid » Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:05 pm

I think we've been though all of this before, but it's probably scattered across the forum and hard to find, so let me summarise.

Transferwise used the middle rate and then shows its fees, so it's transparent. For UK to Chile, in 2019, at the start of the year they charged 1.8%, prices increased to 2.4% in March, and crept up to about 2.6% over the coming months. So it's not a good a deal as it was for UK-Chile. However the % is higher for smaller amounts, and lower for smaller amounts. The figures above were based on having to send individual transactions under 1 million pesos which is the max that Banco Estado Cuenta RUT can receive. Now I have a current account I'll send bigger amounts less often and bring the % closer to 2% again....

That's probably better than a SWIFT because the SWIFT will likely change the X-rate from a middle rate and you probably end up paying 4%-5% all in. I could be wrong - I haven't tried it for many years - so why don't you try sending two transfers on the same day (one from TW and one SWIFT) and check what happens and report here. Whether or not the SWIFT cheats on the exchange rate, adjusting it about typically 3% or so from the middle rate, is the key here.

The absolute cheapest way to do it remains ATM runs, but only if you have a card that has a middle rate and limited fees. And, at least in the UK, most don't. Most cheat about 3% on the exchange rate. I have the Halifax Clarity which charges middle rate with no fees, but charges interest from the day of withdrawal. I can queue up and pay in to the bank account for nothing and depending no how quick I get around to paying the interest I end up paying about 0.3-0.5%....[Edit: As discussed below, this could go up to 1%-2% after you factor in Bank ATMs.]

But those ATM runs take more time, and time is money....

User avatar
DLPurser
Rank: Chile Forum Full Member
Posts: 26
Joined: Sat Mar 07, 2020 5:09 pm

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by DLPurser » Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:12 pm

I lived in Chile with my wife from about 2007 to 2012. When we left, the exchange rate was about 480 clp to the dollar. I used ATM machines or brought dollars into the country when I traveled and I remember the fees were pretty high back then. This time I won't be traveling back to the US every month so my options are the ATM machines or transfers from my US bank to Chile. My bank wants a $45 wife fee and then I have to put up with whatever exchange rate I get. I don't know what the ATM fees in Chile are these days or what I could expect for an exchange rate from them. The transferwise website makes the exchange look pretty good, albeit their fees are better with higher amounts.

User avatar
tiagoabner
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 1447
Joined: Sat Mar 04, 2017 9:48 am
Location: Concón

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by tiagoabner » Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:21 pm

DLPurser wrote:
Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:12 pm
I lived in Chile with my wife from about 2007 to 2012. When we left, the exchange rate was about 480 clp to the dollar. I used ATM machines or brought dollars into the country when I traveled and I remember the fees were pretty high back then. This time I won't be traveling back to the US every month so my options are the ATM machines or transfers from my US bank to Chile. My bank wants a $45 wife fee and then I have to put up with whatever exchange rate I get. I don't know what the ATM fees in Chile are these days or what I could expect for an exchange rate from them. The transferwise website makes the exchange look pretty good, albeit their fees are better with higher amounts.
Banco Estado ATMs charge my cards $5,500 and let me withdraw up to $400,000, although there are some magic ATMs that are sometimes able to give up to $800,000. I think it's a hardware thing, I'm not sure. BCI is the next cheapest one, charging $4,175 for $200,000 (slightly more than 2%), and other banks increase from that. Most Lider and Jumbo supermarkets allow you to withdraw up to $90,000 in cash when paying with a debit card with no fee: this is referred to as "vuelto". It's not useful to pay large bills, but it can be useful if you have one close by and want to have some small change.

ATMs usually get you close to mid-market exchange rates, minus 1-2%. I haven't found a consistent way to figure it out yet.
I'm NOT your lawyer, accountant or financial planner. All information at this post should be considered for your entertainment only. Consult a professional before making a decision regarding whatever topic was mentioned in this post.

mem
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 932
Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2015 11:18 am

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by mem » Tue Apr 14, 2020 9:45 am

tiagoabner wrote:
Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:21 pm
DLPurser wrote:
Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:12 pm
I lived in Chile with my wife from about 2007 to 2012. When we left, the exchange rate was about 480 clp to the dollar. I used ATM machines or brought dollars into the country when I traveled and I remember the fees were pretty high back then. This time I won't be traveling back to the US every month so my options are the ATM machines or transfers from my US bank to Chile. My bank wants a $45 wife fee and then I have to put up with whatever exchange rate I get. I don't know what the ATM fees in Chile are these days or what I could expect for an exchange rate from them. The transferwise website makes the exchange look pretty good, albeit their fees are better with higher amounts.
Banco Estado ATMs charge my cards $5,500 and let me withdraw up to $400,000, although there are some magic ATMs that are sometimes able to give up to $800,000. I think it's a hardware thing, I'm not sure. BCI is the next cheapest one, charging $4,175 for $200,000 (slightly more than 2%), and other banks increase from that. Most Lider and Jumbo supermarkets allow you to withdraw up to $90,000 in cash when paying with a debit card with no fee: this is referred to as "vuelto". It's not useful to pay large bills, but it can be useful if you have one close by and want to have some small change.

ATMs usually get you close to mid-market exchange rates, minus 1-2%. I haven't found a consistent way to figure it out yet.
I'm guessing that when you get 400k out of estado atms, you are getting it in 10K notes? The determining factor appears to be the quantity of notes that the machine can spit out at once which is 40 (slot dispenser). So if the machine doesnt have 20k notes and only 10k notes you will only be able to take out 40x10k. If the machine has 20k notes you can get out 40x20k.

I know that 10k note only machines are really common in santiago

mem
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 932
Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2015 11:18 am

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by mem » Tue Apr 14, 2020 9:55 am

DLPurser wrote:
Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:12 pm
I lived in Chile with my wife from about 2007 to 2012. When we left, the exchange rate was about 480 clp to the dollar. I used ATM machines or brought dollars into the country when I traveled and I remember the fees were pretty high back then. This time I won't be traveling back to the US every month so my options are the ATM machines or transfers from my US bank to Chile. My bank wants a $45 wife fee and then I have to put up with whatever exchange rate I get. I don't know what the ATM fees in Chile are these days or what I could expect for an exchange rate from them. The transferwise website makes the exchange look pretty good, albeit their fees are better with higher amounts.
Do you have a USD denominated account in Chile? If so a wire transfer may be the cheapest for large transfers.
If you do a USD wire transfer to a Chilean USD account you can keep it in USD and convert it to pesos when you want to.
I just looked at doing a transferwise transfer of $2500 USD to CLP and the fee was about $65. Seems like it would be better to pay a flat rate of $40 or $45 for a rare but larger wire transfer. This assumes there is a usd account in chile to transfer to and there are no recieving or intermediary wire fees. My Chilean bank has a single swift intermediary in NY and neither charge a recieve/transit fee. But I do know of at least 1 Chilean bank that does charge an $18 recieve fee. So the specifics matter for each individual

Britkid
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 2330
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2012 6:59 pm
Location: Talagante area, Chile
Contact:

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by Britkid » Tue Apr 14, 2020 11:05 am

Again though, are the wire transfers changing the exchange rate by a few % without telling you? Can you get them to commit to an X-rate in advance like Transferwise does? Usually they say they can't tell you the rate in advance. There is a reason for that....

I didn't include the bank fees when I said you could do ATM runs for 0.3-0.5% with a Halifax Clarity credit card. With bank fees, would be more like 1%-2%.

However, the last time I tried it, the Scotiabank in Talagante was still not charging any fees at all, even after other Scotiabank ATMs have started charging. Not sure if it will be charging nowadays. The last time I tried it was towards the end of 2019.

mem
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 932
Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2015 11:18 am

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by mem » Tue Apr 14, 2020 11:30 am

For the wire transfers it's better to do it in usd and recieve it in usd. With my Chilean usd account they let me convert it to my clp account when I want at a market rate that I can accept or wait for a better rate.

User avatar
tiagoabner
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 1447
Joined: Sat Mar 04, 2017 9:48 am
Location: Concón

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by tiagoabner » Tue Apr 14, 2020 12:01 pm

mem wrote:
Tue Apr 14, 2020 11:30 am
For the wire transfers it's better to do it in usd and recieve it in usd. With my Chilean usd account they let me convert it to my clp account when I want at a market rate that I can accept or wait for a better rate.
That is most likely the case, but you need to be a permanent resident in order to get a USD account.
I'm NOT your lawyer, accountant or financial planner. All information at this post should be considered for your entertainment only. Consult a professional before making a decision regarding whatever topic was mentioned in this post.

User avatar
FrankPintor
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 1362
Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2007 4:53 pm
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by FrankPintor » Fri Apr 17, 2020 8:08 pm

Reporting back to the forum, the transfer I set up with Transferwise on Monday, which I overpaid for and was due to arrive today, well it hasn’t arrived. This is a no-stars, close-your-account performance (which I will be doing)
80C16512-2AB3-4025-B0C1-9D974E5E3CEC.jpeg
My very strong recommendation is to avoid this bunch of scammers.

Oh, and banks are not slow. A SWIFT transfer will arrive the same day in most cases. Transferwise is slow and takes more than 5 days.
Caracas es Caracas. Lo demás es monte y culebra!

User avatar
tiagoabner
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 1447
Joined: Sat Mar 04, 2017 9:48 am
Location: Concón

Re: Online Banking in Chile vs the USA. Is it secure?

Post by tiagoabner » Fri Apr 17, 2020 9:54 pm

FrankPintor wrote:
Fri Apr 17, 2020 8:08 pm
Reporting back to the forum, the transfer I set up with Transferwise on Monday, which I overpaid for and was due to arrive today, well it hasn’t arrived. This is a no-stars, close-your-account performance (which I will be doing) 80C16512-2AB3-4025-B0C1-9D974E5E3CEC.jpeg

My very strong recommendation is to avoid this bunch of scammers.

Oh, and banks are not slow. A SWIFT transfer will arrive the same day in most cases. Transferwise is slow and takes more than 5 days.
I have transferred money through them to my Chilean bank account on Wednesday and it hit my account today. I have transferred money through them to my Brazilian bank account on Wednesday and it hit my account the same day. I have transferred money through them to my German bank account and it has arrived within seconds. I have even sent a payment to an employee in Colombia, a country with restrictions on transfers over USD $5,000, and it has arrived on time.

This issue that you had was most likely a "this dude lives in Argentina" issue rather than with Transferwise.
I'm NOT your lawyer, accountant or financial planner. All information at this post should be considered for your entertainment only. Consult a professional before making a decision regarding whatever topic was mentioned in this post.

Post Reply