War with Iran just started

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ghibli
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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by ghibli » Fri Jan 10, 2020 9:33 am

It has NOT been confirmed that the boeing 737 was brought down by missiles. The indications are that there was an engine failure event at a critical time during takeoff which the pilot was not able to overcome. The black box has been recovered and the final verdict will be announced after review. I suggest that you read up on the multiple problems with the various boeing 737 planes including a massive corporate coverup. The new CEO (the prior was fired) has admitted to some of this. Of course, if you like to live dangerously, go ahead and fly on a 737. Especially one with a poor maintenance history like the Ukraine one. There are plenty of concerned people, including the staff of American Airlines, and Southwest Airlines, who refuse to fly on 737s. But hey, what difference does the truth make?

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eeuunikkeiexpat
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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by eeuunikkeiexpat » Fri Jan 10, 2020 10:20 am

The 737 has a good record it is the now totally grounded 737 MAX that was the problem plane. This was not a 737 MAX. Any engine failure event at the altitude they were lost at would have still been enough time to radio in a mayday.
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mem
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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by mem » Fri Jan 10, 2020 4:20 pm

Yeah just saw an amateur video of it going down. It was on fire and descending at maybe a 30 or 40 degree angle. Im sure the guy with the camera thought it was a meteor or something. When it hit the ground it was a massive explosion that lit up the night sky

If it was not a hostile act then it is one heck of a malfunction to engulf the plane in flames so quickly. Definitely not a garden variety plane crash oopsie

Also...apparently...there were 6 nuclear scientists on board who were "visiting Iran".

So to recap...the US says a missile hit the plane while staring at a Iran. Iran says that is total BS and that videos showing an object hitting the plane before it crashed and exploded cannot be confirmed to be a missile positively.

All that happened during Iran's face saving toothless missile strike that killed noone, that the US was informed of second hand by the Iraqis that were warned by the Iranians several hours before the actual strike

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RocketRichard
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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by RocketRichard » Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:42 pm

I usually don`t post here as you all are more familiar about the various topics that are discussed here than I am. However, on this particular topic, I am very familiar with as I was a Marine FCO (Fire Control Officer) for a HAWK Air Defense Battery for several years as well as being trained in the use of the Stinger missile system. I posted on a FB post immediately following the Ukrainian air crash in Tehran that it smelled like a case of a panicky Iranian FCO or some Lance Corporal Type who was given a MANPADS (Man-portable air-defense system) and told to track, lock and engage any Gringo Drones/Strike Aircraft. The photos of the fuselage the next day clearly showed the puncture holes of airburst shrapnel as well as the tell tale signs of a bent fuselage from external overpressure. The photos of the Malaysian airliner shot down over Ukraine are eerily similiar. Iran is known to have the SA 15 TOR mobile short-medium range SAM system which is radar guided and uses a proximity fused designed for an airburst that will shred its intended target. Whoever authorized its targeting, would have had to started tracking it almost immediately and firing on it after liftoff as the aircraft barely reached 8,000 feet before it was struck. The Iranians lack any integrated Air Defense network, which goes back to my original premise that Persian FCO freaked out.

I am reminded of a story back in the day when the 2nd LAAMBn out of Camp LeJeune, NC was conducting live fire exercises off Onslow Beach. The FCO tracked, locked, and was given permission by the safety officer to fire on a target drone. The young Lcpl at the firing panel refused to fire as he said that the radar signature did not look right. Again, he was told to flip the plastic cover over the firing button and launch. Again he refused, when at that very moment, the Firing Safety Officer came over the radio net, "CHECK FIRE! CHECK FIRE!" The High Power Radar unit that was locked on the "target" that guides the missile until detonation was actually locked onto an Air Florida Jet flying from NYC to Miami and had strayed into unauthorized airspace. By the Grace of God, Go I.

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nwdiver
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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by nwdiver » Fri Jan 10, 2020 8:37 pm

Supposedly their are sat photos of a pair of Tors launched, and as you pointed out the Iranian AD is disfunctional, the reg, iregs and revolutionary guard all have some SAM capability. Crash site has been bulldozed and the black boxes are malfunctioning, the world will know the truth, the Iranians will never admit it, even if it was a gross mistake......
It's all about the wine.

mem
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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by mem » Fri Jan 10, 2020 9:48 pm

it is a sad day when the best case scenario for so many people dying is Iranian field incompetence. As bad as that would be if it is true, the alternative is much worse...that another nation took advantage of the telegraphed face saving stunt to frame Iran at the expense of many innocent lives. Precisely because so many think that Iran will never admit to the mistake.

I can buy the Iranian incompetence narrative, but if it comes to be confirmed that legit nuclear scientists really were on board...then the much darker more sinister geopolitical narrative becomes much more likely

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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by nwdiver » Sat Jan 11, 2020 1:35 am

Well Iran has now admitted they shot the plane down by accident, fog of war incident.......
It's all about the wine.

mem
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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by mem » Sat Jan 11, 2020 9:59 am

Just was reading that top story.

RocketRichard pretty much nailed it with the incompetence explanation.

Sad so many died, but at least there is not more to the story

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eeuunikkeiexpat
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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by eeuunikkeiexpat » Sat Jan 11, 2020 10:01 am

Tragic situation but impressive honesty from a government.
There are two ways to be fooled.

One is to believe what isn't true;

the other is to refuse to believe what is true.

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mem
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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by mem » Sat Jan 11, 2020 10:35 am

Seems iran knew it was inevitable...they couldnt decode the black boxes and had to send them to France and then the Ukrainian investigators found evidence of a missile strike.

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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by admin » Sat Jan 11, 2020 4:15 pm

bert.douglas wrote:
Sat Jan 11, 2020 1:16 pm
mem wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 9:48 pm
I can buy the Iranian incompetence narrative, but if it comes to be confirmed that legit nuclear scientists really were on board...then the much darker more sinister geopolitical narrative becomes much more likely
Well that depends on how many foreign nuclear scientists are working in Iran and how often they travel. It may well be that there are nuclear scientists on every flight. So this could mean nothing. If it is even true.

However, getting slapped in the face with the Epstein "suicide" does draw one's thinking towards conspiracy theories.

It would be easy enough to sneak in to the airport and attach a small box by magnet to the landing gear of the aircraft. This box could contain an IFF transponder to make the airliner appear to be an american warplane.

We will never know the truth. It is by now hopelessly obscured. The first casualty of war.
I vote for nuclear scientist, with a candle stick, on the Ukrainian airplane.

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nwdiver
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Re: War with Iran just started

Post by nwdiver » Sat Jan 11, 2020 9:04 pm

eeuunikkeiexpat wrote:
Sat Jan 11, 2020 10:01 am
Tragic situation but impressive honesty from a government.
They are only honest because the Ukrainian guys saw obvious shrapnel damage and were sending sample that would show what explosive was used to their lab, they have samples of Russian explosives to compare it to, Iran decided their bulldozing of the crash site and saying the Black Boxes were destroyed was not going to save them, now they are saying the Rev Guard didn’t tell them the truth......
It's all about the wine.

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