Building house in Chile the "gringo" way

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KDnR
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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by KDnR » Sat Dec 07, 2019 12:46 pm

admin wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 10:46 am
If your going to build more, crunch the numbers on the next go around. I don't think you are getting that much more out of it structurally relative to the cost.

by that I mean, in 9.0+ quake, that slab is not going to be the deciding factor. connections at the slab, and connections at the roof line will fail long before the slab fails; or, put another way, a 20 to 30,000 pound slab (just guessing here from the photo) on good soil (e.g. compacted rock, etc), is not going to kill anyone, even if it was a really crappy slab. It is already on the ground.

like you said, it will be the connection to the slab that counts. that could have been achieved with much cheaper and quicker threaded anchor hooks, properly tied to the rebar in the slab. essentially the connections bottom plate and top plates of the walls are going to count more in an earthquake.

one of the more useful things I learned about earthquakes comes from actually watching intentional demolitions of buildings. even with explosives, If the roof of a building does not pass outside the footprint of a building, it will not be able to gain sufficient momentum to collapse on its own or reach the "tipping point".

in other words, the slab is not going tip over. it is the rest of the house that will tip over.

see what I am saying?
Yes, I see what you are saying. I have looked at many ways to do that. For what I am trying to achieve it was the best solution. And I agree, there are many ways to get the job done and It will provide different results of course. I saw locals using 2x3 wood studs for a load-bearing wall and they are comfortable with that. What I am doing would not make sense to them at all, but they are saving money vs my house, for sure. As long as all of us happy with the results of what we do and pay for it, it's all good.

I will do my best to have my connections to the slab and roof will withstand much better then houses around build by Chileans.

Btw, the weight of that slab is about 160 000 pounds.

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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by admin » Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:53 pm

yea, at 160,000 that sucker is not going anywhere. the rest of the house perhaps, but not the slab.

I have my own over built foundation story.

did a block stem wall, u.s. standards, with 5/8 rebar bond beams inside.

I somehow over ordered bags of cement for the bond beam across the top, plus vertical filled columns. I was trying to figure out what to do with the extra cement. stumbled across the mix formula the u.s. military uses for nuclear silos. rather than the typical 1-2-3 mix normally used (pretty much covers any residential house need), i decided to toss in the extra begs of cement. think it was like a 1-2-10 mix.

not something I would want to do on a 10 story building, but my foundation is ready for the blast from a minuteman missile. :lol:
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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by admin » Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:57 pm

speaking of nuclear blasts.

look at photos of Hiroshima or Nagasaki, everything gone.

concreate slabs last thing standing.

look at archeological excavations 2,000 to 3,000 years old. last thing standing is the slab.

they are very forgiving, under all conditions and all builder skills.
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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by bert.douglas » Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:49 pm

admin wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:53 pm
...
I somehow over ordered bags of cement for the bond beam across the top, plus vertical filled columns. I was trying to figure out what to do with the extra cement. stumbled across the mix formula the u.s. military uses for nuclear silos. rather than the typical 1-2-3 mix normally used (pretty much covers any residential house need), i decided to toss in the extra begs of cement. think it was like a 1-2-10 mix.
...
http://www.civileblog.com/concrete-mix-ratio/

Strength in megapascals (Cement:Sand:Aggregate)
M5 1:5:10
M7.5 1:4:8
M10 1:3:6
M15 1:2:4
M20 1:1.5:3
M25 1:1:2
M30 1:0.75:1.5
M35 1:0.5:1
M40 1:0.25:0.5

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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by nwdiver » Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:39 pm

In floor not my choice for Chile, break something in there after a bump or from problem during installation and it’s all gone, I use high tech low profile Italian wall mounted radiators.....
It's all about the wine.

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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by admin » Sun Dec 08, 2019 8:01 am

nwdiver wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:39 pm
In floor not my choice for Chile, break something in there after a bump or from problem during installation and it’s all gone, I use high tech low profile Italian wall mounted radiators.....
yea, I am not a big fan of slabs for a bunch of other reasons, but they are generally a good option in chile for dealing with low skilled builders and seismic issues.

I have done my fair share of chasing leaky pipes in concrete floors. Not fun, and definitely messy.

They also tend not to seal or insulate them correctly, but that is easily remedied with a bit of supervision.
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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by hlf2888 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 9:39 am

nwdiver wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:39 pm
In floor not my choice for Chile, break something in there after a bump or from problem during installation and it’s all gone, I use high tech low profile Italian wall mounted radiators.....
Agree, I will skip the heated floors (or maybe only in bathroom) and make sure all my plumbing is at outside walls. Are the radiators steam or electric?

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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by nwdiver » Sun Dec 08, 2019 4:37 pm

hlf2888 wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 9:39 am
nwdiver wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:39 pm
In floor not my choice for Chile, break something in there after a bump or from problem during installation and it’s all gone, I use high tech low profile Italian wall mounted radiators.....
Agree, I will skip the heated floors (or maybe only in bathroom) and make sure all my plumbing is at outside walls. Are the radiators steam or electric?
Hot water from a very high efficiency boiler, each has an individual thermostat on it so only rooms that need to be heated are turned up, the rest are at 15C. There are some good German made ones that are easily available in Chile, they are essentially high output “calafonts”. Mine came in with the radiators, it is also demand hot water, the efficiency is over 90%. The Europeans build these systems, North Americans are idiots when it comes to space and water heating, they use brute force. Chilean don’t heat much as “it’s only for 3 months, eh”.
It's all about the wine.

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nwdiver
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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by nwdiver » Sun Dec 08, 2019 4:46 pm

admin wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 8:01 am
nwdiver wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:39 pm
In floor not my choice for Chile, break something in there after a bump or from problem during installation and it’s all gone, I use high tech low profile Italian wall mounted radiators.....
yea, I am not a big fan of slabs for a bunch of other reasons, but they are generally a good option in chile for dealing with low skilled builders and seismic issues.

I have done my fair share of chasing leaky pipes in concrete floors. Not fun, and definitely messy.

They also tend not to seal or insulate them correctly, but that is easily remedied with a bit of supervision.
Agreed, I don’t like piping passing through foundation walls in Chile, as I don’t want it breaking in there, I buried it deep and passed it under the foundation, which is what I would have had to do if it was through the foundation and broke in there.

A relative ran the black water main in a poured slab, well that didn’t work so well......they had to move out of the house for 2 months to have a little problem dealt with, and he is a very good engineer.
It's all about the wine.

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Dosedmonkey
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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by Dosedmonkey » Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:12 am

admin wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:53 pm
I somehow over ordered bags of cement for the bond beam across the top, plus vertical filled columns. I was trying to figure out what to do with the extra cement. stumbled across the mix formula the u.s. military uses for nuclear silos. rather than the typical 1-2-3 mix normally used (pretty much covers any residential house need), i decided to toss in the extra begs of cement. think it was like a 1-2-10 mix.

not something I would want to do on a 10 story building, but my foundation is ready for the blast from a minuteman missile. :lol:
Are you ever going to have to drill in to that? Will it be a nightmare? Just for future reference.

With water mains usually you can run them around the outside of a building and have kitchen and bathroom supplies come in from out that way. Like hlf2888 says.

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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by admin » Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:31 am

Dosedmonkey wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:12 am
admin wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:53 pm
I somehow over ordered bags of cement for the bond beam across the top, plus vertical filled columns. I was trying to figure out what to do with the extra cement. stumbled across the mix formula the u.s. military uses for nuclear silos. rather than the typical 1-2-3 mix normally used (pretty much covers any residential house need), i decided to toss in the extra begs of cement. think it was like a 1-2-10 mix.

not something I would want to do on a 10 story building, but my foundation is ready for the blast from a minuteman missile. :lol:
Are you ever going to have to drill in to that? Will it be a nightmare? Just for future reference.

With water mains usually you can run them around the outside of a building and have kitchen and bathroom supplies come in from out that way. Like hlf2888 says.
There is a 10 inch pine rim board.

I also ran utility chases with big pvc pipes through the footing where needed, plus an extra one, to allow smaller pipes to be changed out inside them easily. also allows the structure to move independent of the pipes in an earthquake.

I own a jack hammer and a concrete saw. It is hard concreate, but not impossible to go through.
Spencer Global Chile: Legal, relocation, and Investment assistance in Chile.
For more information visit: https://www.spencerglobal.com

From USA and outside Chile dial 1-917-727-5985 (U.S.), in Chile dial 65 2 42 1024 or by cell 747 97974.

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Re: Building house in Chile "gringo" way

Post by Dosedmonkey » Tue Dec 10, 2019 10:12 am

That's a good idea, pipes inside outer pipe for earthquakes. I hadn't seen that, but seems obvious now.

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