Housing market situation

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at46
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by at46 » Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:35 pm

Space Cat wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 5:12 pm
at46 wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:22 am
By law, only one person in the store is allowed to touch cash.
Oh, why? What about busier stores like ferreterías with 2-3 cashiers near each other?
I guess it's a type of protection against the inevitable 'shrinkage' of goods. The people who cut and weigh your meat in a local carniceria, for example, give you a ticket from their electronic scale that you hand to the cashier. Or they have a SKU scanner to print those tickets. Then the cashier gives you a reciept for your money and another ticket (or the same ticket with the cashier stamp on it) that you hand to the third person who packs your goods and hands you your bag. Thus, they have a cross-check system for monitoring physical amounts of goods sold against cash recieved. And they created three jobs to do work that can easily be done by one.

Cashiers in computerized supermarkets all have their own lockable cash boxes that they bring to the check-out counter and take with them when they leave. I guess if the amount of cash they got in their box is less than the value of goods they scanned, they might have to cough up the difference.

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Re: Housing market situation

Post by admin » Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:59 pm

Space Cat wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 5:12 pm
at46 wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:22 am
By law, only one person in the store is allowed to touch cash.
Oh, why? What about busier stores like ferreterías with 2-3 cashiers near each other?
show me that law?

there are thousands of one worker shops in chile.

the old school, 3 people doing a checkout process that only one should be doing, is to keep the workers from ripping off their employer.

only recent years has it started to click with shop owners, that even if their employees rip them off from time to time it is a hell of a lot cheaper than the two extra employees slowing down sales (and being ripped off by two more employees). it was a dumb idea then, and it is dumb idea now.
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by admin » Thu Sep 05, 2019 7:12 pm

those stores that do that also tend to play the 'whos on first' game. they hide their products in the back room, so you have to guess what they have. you go in and have to ask some lazy unhappy clerk what they have, that just goes, " well what do you want to buy"?

i go, "well what do have to sell"?

clerk, "well what do you want to buy"?

at that point i have lost interest and walked out.

I simply don't do buisness anymore with those sorts of shops.

and if i do by chance buy something, i am going to have to visit at least three more desks to get my product? probably, just to find out at the end when trying to pick it up they don't actually have it in stock. so, you get visit three different desks all over again to get a refund.

welcome to 2019, not 1919. fire 2/3rds of your employees, and replace them with a computer, and display your products where i can see them.
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at46
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by at46 » Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:04 pm

admin wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:59 pm
show me that law?
If you see thousands of stores with the three step purchasing system and a caja cabin built in every one of them, doesn't it point to some sort of regulation they're following?
admin wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:59 pm
there are thousands of one worker shops in chile.
Store owners or their close relatives. I've yet to see a one man store run a by a hired hand.

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eeuunikkeiexpat
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by eeuunikkeiexpat » Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:42 am

Doubt regulation but covering one's ass from getting ripped off by a hired hand makes total sense and making sure those hired hand/s know that one is not ignorant of that possibility also makes total sense.
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the other is to refuse to believe what is true.

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at46
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by at46 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 10:41 am

eeuunikkeiexpat wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:42 am
Doubt regulation but covering one's ass from getting ripped off by a hired hand makes total sense and making sure those hired hand/s know that one is not ignorant of that possibility also makes total sense.
The system is completely inefficient in preventing theft, which is why you always see the owner in the store at all hours, and you never see a small mom and pop shop being able to open a second or third location relying on hired hands. The system does boost the number of employees and forces additional spending by the owner on the caja cabins. In the absense of a certain government regulation controlling these things, you'd see more variance around the country.

There's a huge Chinese mall in my neighbourhood that was installed a couple of years ago. And, sure enough, following that regulation, they have a check-out counter where you get a ticket that you then need to take to a separate enclosed caja booth to pay. The Chinese being effeciency freaks but also sticklers for lawful details, I can't see them setting it up that way just for fun.

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Re: Housing market situation

Post by admin » Fri Sep 06, 2019 10:42 am

at46 wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:04 pm
admin wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:59 pm
show me that law?
If you see thousands of stores with the three step purchasing system and a caja cabin built in every one of them, doesn't it point to some sort of regulation they're following?
admin wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:59 pm
there are thousands of one worker shops in chile.
Store owners or their close relatives. I've yet to see a one man store run a by a hired hand.
they are called a "mall".
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at46
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by at46 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 10:53 am

admin wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 10:42 am
at46 wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:04 pm
admin wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:59 pm
show me that law?
If you see thousands of stores with the three step purchasing system and a caja cabin built in every one of them, doesn't it point to some sort of regulation they're following?
admin wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 6:59 pm
there are thousands of one worker shops in chile.
Store owners or their close relatives. I've yet to see a one man store run a by a hired hand.
they are called the "mall".
The mall is not a one man store and operates on a different set of rules.

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fraggle092
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by fraggle092 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 11:07 am

There is no law that designates who handles customer cash in a shop, purchasing is compartmentalized to prevent fraud and theft. Even that's not foolproof as employees will ponerse de acuerdo given the opportunity. The fact that this system is so widespread in smaller shops gives an idea of the extent of the problem.

Apart from direct losses, its the business owner, not the employee, who is answerable to the SII, and irregularidades caused by employees dishonesty can be subject to heavy fines.
After several costly experiences in our little negocio, all cash payments and facturas are only handled by me personally. We have had prospective employees walk out when they discover that they will not be handling cash.

La ocasión hace el ladrón

Not so much of a problem in big stores that have POS systems (and skilled personnel to manage them) in place.
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by admin » Fri Sep 06, 2019 11:26 am

I just went in to the local copec

bought cup of coffee and a roll.

one of the largest companies in south america. hardly a mom and pop operation. it was just me and the girl serving my coffee and taking my money.

there is no law or regulation mandating a dedicated money handler in stores.

in fact that buisness model is disappearing rappidly for one simple reason: ATM cards.

we had small tourist store a couple years ago in frutillar; and yes, we had one employee, left alone for hours at a time running it, and she handled cash, sales, and everything else. I was not too worried about her ripping us off, because there simply was almost no cash ever in the store beyond a little bit of daily change. all the products were bar coded. Like 95% of our sales were done by card. in fact, i did not want much cash hanging around ever, simply because it was a security risk. i figured if there was never much more than 30,000 to 50,000 pesos, then anyone getting creative would go rob someone else.

it is just an old crusty 'we do it this way, because we have always done it this way' buisness practice.
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by fraggle092 » Fri Sep 06, 2019 11:29 am

Small stores still do a lot of cash transactions. And there are still plenty other ways to steal even with plastic. Undercharging is just one. Chilean negocios don't spend money on extra personnel just because "it's always been done that way"
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by admin » Fri Sep 06, 2019 11:54 am

yea, if they get the 40 hour work week passed, all those dead weight jobs are going disappear all the faster. most employers are not going to add more people, they are going to automate away the position.

I had good chuckle the other day. some executive in an interview said something like, "we should not be letting a bunch of kids that went from the university direct to Congress, and never held a job in either the public or private sector, make major economic or buisness decisions". referring to the little commies in congress.

They can push 40 hours or even 35 hour work week, and all they are doing is insuring the people that voted for them get to join the structurally unemployed permanently.
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