Housing market situation

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41southchile
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by 41southchile » Tue Dec 11, 2018 11:40 pm

at46 wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:03 pm
If you're planning to buy with cash vs. a mortgage, let them know right away in your initial email. That usually puts you in the front of the queue.
Yes, good advice, cash is king. We are actually thinking of charging a surcharge for those that want to buy with mortages , or giving cash discount , banks or rather the useless staff that work there that don't know how to do their job most of the time.
It means it takes so much longer for the sale to go through and the added costs of getting paperwork together and time spent and invested on satisfying the bank means I would definitely give cash buyers priority . A mortgage sale is still a sale in the end, but those buying with mortgages do come with a noticeable cost to the vendor,
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by admin » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:35 am

yea i would say any real estate transaction we have handled, when a mortgage is involved with either buyer or seller, add about another two to three months to the mortgage process on average while the banks do their thing (or not).
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by paladin » Wed Dec 12, 2018 7:45 pm

mem wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:53 pm
If they dont reply it is probably already sold or at least an offer accepted.
Sorry, that’s not my experience.

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Re: Housing market situation

Post by paladin » Wed Dec 12, 2018 7:48 pm

at46 wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:03 pm
If you're planning to buy with cash vs. a mortgage, let them know right away in your initial email. That usually puts you in the front of the queue.
That’s exactly what I do. In certain high demand areas, I think the corredora finds an interested party, then concentrates on him, before moving on to another one. These people are not exactly professionals.

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Re: Housing market situation

Post by at46 » Wed Dec 12, 2018 8:17 pm

paladin wrote:
Wed Dec 12, 2018 7:48 pm
at46 wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:03 pm
If you're planning to buy with cash vs. a mortgage, let them know right away in your initial email. That usually puts you in the front of the queue.
That’s exactly what I do. In certain high demand areas, I think the corredora finds an interested party, then concentrates on him, before moving on to another one. These people are not exactly professionals.
Yes. Another thing is that often times the same property is being marketed by two different corredores/real estate agencies. Often times with a great price difference, but exactly the same unprofessional photos posted for both listings on portalinmobiliario, for example. Only if it says that the listing is exclusive for this corredor can you actually have a bit more certainty of what's going on.

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Re: Housing market situation

Post by Baltimore » Sat Dec 29, 2018 9:49 am

From El Mercurio today, rental prices have been flat or declined in the las few years in Las Condes and they are expected to keep going down due to the large volume of newly available apartments bought for rentals ("as investments") and an almost flat demand for properties in that price range.
IMG_5218.PNG
Of course, apartment values (for purchasing one) are unstoppable, they will keep escalating with no end in sight because......
It's fascinating to see how basic principles of finance (arbitrage) and economics simply don't apply here.

BTW, I'm curious where they get their numbers for the stats. I live in a large and nice apartment in Las Condes and pay like 50% less than what they show as average prices per square meter. Same thing for friends that rent in Las Condes. It almost seem like they used asking prices straight out of portalinmobiliario.com for apartments near El Golf, which are the most expensive ones.

Advice for gringos looking for rentals in Las Condes: Don't ever pay the posted price in portalinmobiliario.com unless its an extremely hot property and there is a line of folks waiting behind you to rent it (this is not SF). Throw a lowball and leave with a straight face and wait for them to call you back. If you speak Spanish, sometimes even walking around and asking conserjes for available properties and rental prices can get you pretty good deals!

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Re: Housing market situation

Post by admin » Sat Dec 29, 2018 1:13 pm

those "average" numbers get skewed badly by the luxury rental markwt in and around los condes.

We have rented apartment for our high end clients north of $10,000 u.s. a month in los condes. i think the most expensive was close to $20,000 u.s. month. those stats probably also include things like the apartment / residence at the W hotel. we rented one of the W apartments for a client several years ago it was in the millions of pesos a month (can not recall at the moment, but obviously really expensive). ironicaly i don't think the client ever even spent a night there.

essentialy, at the top, there is 'the price is irrelevant' market, and they are not for rent on airbnb, or even by most the real estate agents. lots of super rich foriegners and corporate excutives, that the company is picking up the tab. also a large market for "second homes" for people that live outside santiago, occassionaly travel there, and "the other women" storage fatalities.

so, it only takes a few of those (and there are a suprising amount of them in los condes), to move all those stats. also the uber expensive luxury market is very impervious to market swings of what is going on in the bottom feeding mom and pop speculators.
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by admin » Sat Dec 29, 2018 1:24 pm

you also have the big international investors. they come in and say buy all the apartments on an entire side of a new building, then don't even rent any of the apartments. they just sit on them until they get the right combination of currency moves and property apreciation before selling. so they are mopping up supply in the market, without putting rental supply on the market.
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by 41southchile » Fri Jan 25, 2019 8:02 am

So apparantly according to Forbes
Chile is good buying for second house overseas , not too sure on how accurate their description of Chile is https://www.forbes.com/sites/kathleenpe ... fedbc379be
Here is the local Emol story about the Firbes story ,
https://www.emol.com/noticias/Economia/ ... r-que.html
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by admin » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:50 am

That is more than a bit misleading on a bunch of fronts. Has the classic reporter calling around, just repeating whatever B.S. was fed to them on the phone of the person that answered. I have learned the hard way to be careful when such reporters call me, because they will just repeat whatever I say, and not even do a good job of repeating it. I use to do interviews with the BBC, Wall street journal, etc. About 90% of the time they would take something I said out of context to fit their article narrative.

They also picked the bottom of the copper price and exchange rate over the last 10 years to start their "46%" dollar appreciation.
https://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from ... P&view=10Y

Probably the bigger issue however is the shear lack of actionable information in that article. Just sufficient to be dangerous.

Notice how EMOL just parroted the Forbes report. Years ago I did an interview with the wall street journal about real estate in Chile. The next day I was getting a bunch of calls from reporters in Chile doing reports, on the report like that. The funny one was, the journalist that called, from a paper, that we had already received a call from another journalist at the same paper a few hours earlier. They did not even know someone else in their office had beat them to the easy lazy report on a report.
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by admin » Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:47 am

admin wrote:
Thu Nov 22, 2018 9:39 am
so funny story i just was told.

my wife and i rent an apartment in los condes, near the golf course. we use it perhaps on average 10 days a month depending on the flow of work and other things, or just passing through santiago on the way to somewhere else. we lend it out to friends and family that live in the south when they need to go to Santiago. sort of our own apart hotel in Santiago.

so the owner told us she was going to sell it. she offered it to us at like 140 million pesos. gave it some thought, but just can not bring myself to buy one of those concrete coffins, when i know there is perhaps 10 to 20 million pesos of materials in a 1 bedroom apartment. i also got a bunch of issues with the apartment. fine for few days a month, dont want to buy the problems. we were kicking around the idea of renting something closer to our office anyway. not like we HAVE to have thst apartment because for instance we got kids in school or something.

so she put it on the market. guess how long it lasted?

sold in 2 weeks, to someone looking for investment property.

The new owner was ecstatic to have good renters already in the place (we are hardly there, pay our rent on time, and have made improvements on the place) and has offered us a new contract for as long we want to stay. still debating renting something a bit bigger and closer yo our office. we can make up the difference in taxi rides, but for moment dont want to deal with hassle of moving.
oooo, so this story got juicy out of the blue (I kind of half expected this). It is soooo Santiago real estate market.

Owner and buyer of the apartment are at the notary. My wife get's a call from the current owner, that they are about to sign the buy / sale agreement. The buyer out of the blue says she is going to increase our rent by like 250,000 pesos a month, and basically blackmails the current owner in to paying the difference on our rent until our current contract is up (it is up in like April or something), or she is not going to buy the apartment. Guess the owner paid to get the deal done, not sure what happened there.

My wife did not even bother asking me what I thought. She knew what I was going to say. She just immediately told them, "no way are we paying that, and we are taking this as formal notice".

Honestly, we were only willing to keep that apartment at the current rent, just out of shear laziness / got better things to do right now besides hunting for another apartment.

Classic case of a Chilean misreading the situation, getting greedy, and then overplaying their hand. We know if they do something like that now, it will be something else later. I have one standing rule with all the land lords I have dealt with in Chile over the years: You don't bother me, I won't bother you; and anytime one thinks they can arbitrarily raise rent out of the blue, they get a pleasant, 'good luck with that' and notice of termination of the contract. They can eat that mortgage payment for a few months without a renter.

Probably did us a favor to the tune of several million pesos anyway. Needed something closer to our office, and that apartment had an issue with street noise (4th floor with a busy street in the morning).

However, I could see that working on say a family that was renting, kids are in the local school, or mom and dad are near work, possibly them not having the money to move, etc. We don't play game.
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Re: Housing market situation

Post by 41southchile » Fri Jan 25, 2019 12:39 pm

admin wrote:
Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:50 am
That is more than a bit misleading on a bunch of fronts. Has the classic reporter calling around, just repeating whatever B.S. was fed to them on the phone of the person that answered. I have learned the hard way to be careful when such reporters call me, because they will just repeat whatever I say, and not even do a good job of repeating it. I use to do interviews with the BBC, Wall street journal, etc. About 90% of the time they would take something I said out of context to fit their article narrative.

They also picked the bottom of the copper price and exchange rate over the last 10 years to start their "46%" dollar appreciation.
https://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from ... P&view=10Y

Probably the bigger issue however is the shear lack of actionable information in that article. Just sufficient to be dangerous.

Notice how EMOL just parroted the Forbes report. Years ago I did an interview with the wall street journal about real estate in Chile. The next day I was getting a bunch of calls from reporters in Chile doing reports, on the report like that. The funny one was, the journalist that called, from a paper, that we had already received a call from another journalist at the same paper a few hours earlier. They did not even know someone else in their office had beat them to the easy lazy report on a report.
Never trust a journalist is good advice, learnt that too.
Yes Emol parrots everything from overseas english articles, was interesting to note the comments below that article, I'm not a fan of reading comments on newspaper articles, but nowadays most of the reporting is so shitty and lazy anyway that in amongst the dozens of crappy comments you find some gems that sometimes offer more insights than the article itself.
I can't decide for you. You'll have to make up your own mind.

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