PDI guys, busted

Gripes and complaints about Chile. What does not kill you, only makes you stronger. Help make Chile a better place, and help other gringos avoid problems and mistakes.
Vicki and Greg Lansen
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 2275
Joined: Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:02 pm

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by Vicki and Greg Lansen » Mon Oct 22, 2012 11:48 am

Hey Hybrid...your post confused me (though that is not hard to do). "So after all, be them, PDI or Caribineros, neither one are to be not too clean after all"? Confusing. But let me clear that up. Caribineros are probably some of the "cleanest" LEO's in the world.

nate22re
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 71
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 7:32 pm
Location: santiago

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by nate22re » Mon Oct 22, 2012 4:29 pm

Correct me if I am wrong but I was told that you could never become a caribinero if you had any criminals in your family. I know a few caribineros and it seems to be a thing that runs in the family. I went to an asado and was surprised to learn that half of the men there were or had been caribineros and they were all related. If the criminal thing is true then one caribinero getting convicted has a consequence of disqualifying sons, daughters, cousins, nephews and nieces and such from applying to the academy. That is something to be said for the caribineros; they have an academy. The PDI was advertising in the metro a few months ago with examples of people that got a degree in architecture or some other unrelated degree and then decided to go work for the PDI and you could too!

User avatar
nwdiver
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 2994
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:45 pm
Location: Vancouver, BC and Chile where ever it's Summer
Contact:

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by nwdiver » Mon Oct 22, 2012 5:17 pm

my $0.02


The Carabineros are a professional national uniformed police force and one of the elements of the Chilean Standing Forces. The PDI are an investigative unit of the judicial system. This is how it was explained to me years ago. The Carabineros are moved around and work within a military structure, the PDI work like police in other countries. I can see the difference in structure allowing for the issues they are finding in the PDI.
Many years ago I was told the moving of the Carabineros was to prevent them become overly friendly in any one area. You are not likely to build a relationship with someone leaving 2-3 years down the line, so that and thier high level of discipline has made them one of the best police forces in Latin America.
The PDI will get shaken up and their command may come from the Carabineros.
It's all about the wine.

User avatar
Dosedmonkey
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 785
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2011 12:27 am

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by Dosedmonkey » Mon Oct 22, 2012 6:14 pm

What is horrible about them running the PDI & Carabiners seperately, is not only the fact it creates two seperate budgets, and two seperate sets of people competing at making the same ends. But in other police forces, a guy with not so much qualifications has the chance to work up through the standard police positions and make it to the top jobs through hard work and work based studying, In fact in the UK police it is not important your past experience, you first need work through the local patrol jobs, before you can specialist units, before you can become a sergant, and you need become a sergent before you can become a detective. This means you can't get people in places of power like the PDI with out them doing the hard graft first.

People who have degrees can go into investigation units in the UK, but they do not have the power of police, only the power to investigate and collect evidence, in support of the police. In this respect I think the PDI should be working for the Carabineros.

Despite Pinat being a soft spunge, his government has put a lot more money, in to a lot more important things. Such as funding for school and hosital construction has double under his government, I stumbled across this when trying to find building legislation here.

I was in Vitacura yesterday, and surprised by the amount of private security guards patrolling the area, with brand new equipment, two young security guards on motorbikes didn't even know they were going to get a bollocking from me for stopping on a pedestrain crossing. If there money was directed in to funding more police in the area, that would be money better spent in my opinion.

User avatar
admin
Site Admin
Posts: 17909
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 11:02 pm
Location: Frutillar, Chile
Contact:

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by admin » Mon Oct 22, 2012 6:20 pm

Here is the thing, for most foreigners living in Chile, your only interaction with the PDI should be at the boarder going in and out of the country, or requesting things like an entry and exit report for applying for residency. Well, that is if you are behaving yourself in the country. If you are having more interaction than that with the PDI, you got much bigger problems to worry about.

This is not Argentina. Even a truly corrupt PDI guy, is not going to hit you up for a bribe at the boarder. The problem is related to the vice cop sort of thing, where they were getting a little to cosy with their targets of investigation. As I understand this current scandal, it is just like the LAPD in the 80's and 90's where the vice squads went off the reservation.

For day to day living in Chile, as long as you are behaving yourself, it will be the Carabineros you are most likly to interact with for such things as the random checks of your car documents, getting certificates of residency in a particular town, or whatever. Ho hum, cop sort of stuff. When it comes to having to deal with police, anywhere in the World, I would much rather deal with the Carabineros than any other police force I have encountered (that includes the USA, European countries, most of Asia, definitely the rest of latin Ameica).

It is funny, the fact that we have at least two people in this thread that have been invited to ride on the Carabineros horses (vicky's mom and myself), says a lot about just how relaxed and friendly these guys are. If you looked at police horse the wrong way in the States, they likly would have beaten you and sent you to a beach resort in Cuba. I use to avoid even asking simple questions of the police in the States, because they always made you feel like a criminal (Me: sir could you tell me how to get to x, y, or z. Police Officer: why you want to know that? what you doing here? let me see some ID?).
Spencer Global Chile: Legal, relocation, and Investment assistance in Chile.
For more information visit: https://www.spencerglobal.com

From USA and outside Chile dial 1-917-727-5985 (U.S.), in Chile dial 65 2 42 1024 or by cell 747 97974.

Andres
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 2696
Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 3:09 am
Location: in transit

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by Andres » Mon Oct 22, 2012 6:27 pm

My CLP10 outsider's view:
I can see that maintaining Carabineros and PDI separately can have disadvantages regarding budget and coordination.
However, maintaining two separate command structures enables there to be a "balance of power" so that one can be used by a right-minded government to investigate the other when there is a possibility of corruption.
Chile: My expectations are low. Very low.
I accept chaos. I'm not sure whether it accepts me.

User avatar
nwdiver
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 2994
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:45 pm
Location: Vancouver, BC and Chile where ever it's Summer
Contact:

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by nwdiver » Mon Oct 22, 2012 7:20 pm

The Carabineros are like the Canadian RCMP (they both have horses) in Western Canada (not Eastern Canada) they are the provincial police, in some places the city police force and the national police for the ports, airport and interprovincial stuff. They have a higher level of training (than provincial or city cops) and were once better at policing, talk first shoot second this went downhill for awhile, lately they have improved, TASER use has dropped 85% in the last 3 years ;)
It's all about the wine.

User avatar
Dosedmonkey
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 785
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2011 12:27 am

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by Dosedmonkey » Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:50 pm

admin wrote: For day to day living in Chile, as long as you are behaving yourself, it will be the Carabineros you are most likly to interact with for such things as the random checks of your car documents, getting certificates of residency in a particular town, or whatever. Ho hum, cop sort of stuff. When it comes to having to deal with police, anywhere in the World, I would much rather deal with the Carabineros than any other police force I have encountered (that includes the USA, European countries, most of Asia, definitely the rest of latin Ameica).

It is funny, the fact that we have at least two people in this thread that have been invited to ride on the Carabineros horses (vicky's mom and myself), says a lot about just how relaxed and friendly these guys are. If you looked at police horse the wrong way in the States, they likly would have beaten you and sent you to a beach resort in Cuba. I use to avoid even asking simple questions of the police in the States, because they always made you feel like a criminal (Me: sir could you tell me how to get to x, y, or z. Police Officer: why you want to know that? what you doing here? let me see some ID?).
My fiance was quite happy to have some photos with policemen in London. Including those political protection protecting Houses of Parliament entrance. Okay they get paid a lot more, and have access to world class equipment, but I would say most Northern European police do a equally good job as the carabineros in my opinion.

As for police horses. Out dated, dangerous for predestrains, indescriminate in crowd control. I almost got crushed by a police horse waiting to enter a music gig before. I don't see why a modern police force would want to use them, especailly in some where like Europe or USA where they have the funds to use better technology and more boots on the ground.

I like the police dogs here, they seem a lot more realaxed here, they are real Chileans. :lol:

User avatar
admin
Site Admin
Posts: 17909
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 11:02 pm
Location: Frutillar, Chile
Contact:

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by admin » Tue Oct 23, 2012 2:42 pm

In Santiago, not really sure why they still have them. However, there is a very real need for them in other parts of Chile. The one I was on in the mountains outside of Futa near the boarder, and we had just spent the whole morning jumping our own horses up mountain trails blocked by trees and fording ice cold rushing creeks that you could not get across any other way. There is no mechanized way to access those places. Even on foot, there is a lot of the South that is totally inaccessible because of the rivers. its horse or nothing.
Spencer Global Chile: Legal, relocation, and Investment assistance in Chile.
For more information visit: https://www.spencerglobal.com

From USA and outside Chile dial 1-917-727-5985 (U.S.), in Chile dial 65 2 42 1024 or by cell 747 97974.

User avatar
nwdiver
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 2994
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:45 pm
Location: Vancouver, BC and Chile where ever it's Summer
Contact:

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by nwdiver » Tue Oct 23, 2012 3:33 pm

Dosedmonkey wrote:
admin wrote: For day to day living in Chile, as long as you are behaving yourself, it will be the Carabineros you are most likly to interact with for such things as the random checks of your car documents, getting certificates of residency in a particular town, or whatever. Ho hum, cop sort of stuff. When it comes to having to deal with police, anywhere in the World, I would much rather deal with the Carabineros than any other police force I have encountered (that includes the USA, European countries, most of Asia, definitely the rest of latin Ameica).

It is funny, the fact that we have at least two people in this thread that have been invited to ride on the Carabineros horses (vicky's mom and myself), says a lot about just how relaxed and friendly these guys are. If you looked at police horse the wrong way in the States, they likly would have beaten you and sent you to a beach resort in Cuba. I use to avoid even asking simple questions of the police in the States, because they always made you feel like a criminal (Me: sir could you tell me how to get to x, y, or z. Police Officer: why you want to know that? what you doing here? let me see some ID?).
My fiance was quite happy to have some photos with policemen in London. Including those political protection protecting Houses of Parliament entrance. Okay they get paid a lot more, and have access to world class equipment, but I would say most Northern European police do a equally good job as the carabineros in my opinion.

As for police horses. Out dated, dangerous for predestrains, indescriminate in crowd control. I almost got crushed by a police horse waiting to enter a music gig before. I don't see why a modern police force would want to use them, especailly in some where like Europe or USA where they have the funds to use better technology and more boots on the ground.

I like the police dogs here, they seem a lot more realaxed here, they are real Chileans. :lol:



Horses are great both for PR (quiet walks through town) and crowd control, 1 horse equals 10 men in a riot, Toronto was looking at getting rid of its horses until the G20 riots and 10 officers on horses controlled most of a big crowd, they just ride around them, people that would push back on a solid cordon of police men, move away from horses. Besides what would the Royal Canadian MOUNTED Police do without horses???
It's all about the wine.

User avatar
Dosedmonkey
Rank: Chile Forum Citizen
Posts: 785
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2011 12:27 am

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by Dosedmonkey » Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:57 pm

admin wrote:In Santiago, not really sure why they still have them. However, there is a very real need for them in other parts of Chile. The one I was on in the mountains outside of Futa near the boarder, and we had just spent the last the whole morning jumping our own horses up mountain trails blocked by trees and fording ice cold rushing creeks that you could not get across any other way. There is no mechanized way to access those places. Even on foot, they a lot of the South is inaccessible because of the rivers. its horse or nothing.
Well that falls into what I aid about funds. In the UK they would use helicopters. Although they are on a massive budget cut right now in the UK for the recession, so maybe they need use their horses more for this. Although the animal rights people would probably blow up a police station or something.

If you want something people will move away from, big police dogs scare people a lot more then police horses. :lol:

User avatar
admin
Site Admin
Posts: 17909
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 11:02 pm
Location: Frutillar, Chile
Contact:

Re: PDI guys, busted

Post by admin » Tue Oct 23, 2012 6:37 pm

You can't fly a helicopters where a lot of those horses work in the Patagonia. Perhaps, like 1 to 2 weeks a year, you might get lucky and the conditions would be just right to get a helicopter in, and then there is nowhere to land because of the trees. Between the mountains and the weather (cloud cover most of the year), it is just not accessible in any sort of reliable mechanized way. So, I don't think the horses are going away any time soon.

It was kind of funny. they had a new carabinerio from Santiago that was just learning how to ride a horse for the first time after being reassigned to Futa. Total on the job training. The guy was just terrified. That was definitely not like learning to ride in a park in central Santiago. Both my wife and I have ridden most of our life, and it was seriously challenging terrain (the horse and rider are in the air more than on the ground).
Spencer Global Chile: Legal, relocation, and Investment assistance in Chile.
For more information visit: https://www.spencerglobal.com

From USA and outside Chile dial 1-917-727-5985 (U.S.), in Chile dial 65 2 42 1024 or by cell 747 97974.

Post Reply