chile's migration crisis

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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby admin » Sun Aug 27, 2017 10:02 am

Well a congresman on tv just claimed there was an agrement between the left and the right to pass the law, making whatever changes, before the election.
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Julito
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby Julito » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:16 am

I've not as yet been able a direct reference to the banning of millinery, but in here is a line or three mentioning that Spain was merely a conduit of its empire wealth to the rest of Europe rather than investing all that bullion in industrial development. The word "lazy" also appears.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2003/ ... ianreview1

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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby frozen-north » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:50 am

Julito wrote:
I've not as yet been able a direct reference to the banning of millinery, but in here is a line or three mentioning that Spain was merely a conduit of its empire wealth to the rest of Europe rather than investing all that bullion in industrial development. The word "lazy" also appears.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2003/ ... ianreview1


There is also the word 'green'. So?

Actually I did read the 28 page PDF document that was available on the previous link, in addition to a few other pages. An interesting, but long, reading that shows a rather complex politico-economic historical time. As you just pointed in this post, there was more to the story than just a 'banning of milliners'. One aspect that The Guardian article barely mentions are all the wars of those years:

But Castile was not rich and its taxpayers strained to bankroll the endless succession of wars waged by the monarchy. So the crown depended on diplomatic links and foreign contractors for advice, weapons, soldiers, engineers, ships and, most vitally, for credit.


A monarchy from the Habsburg dinasty:

Under the Habsburgs, Spain dominated Europe politically and militarily for much of the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries but experienced a gradual decline of influence in the second half of the seventeenth century under the later Habsburg kings.[

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habsburg_Spain


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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby Julito » Sun Aug 27, 2017 12:09 pm

Yep, a very complex history and I'm sure the actual book would go into all those wars in detail. Re "lazy", it's the context in which it's used to make the point.

We'll have to agree to disagree :)

frozen-north
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby frozen-north » Sun Aug 27, 2017 12:19 pm

The word is used in a very specific way, in that context it does not validate in any way what you had said.

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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby at46 » Sun Aug 27, 2017 12:34 pm

frozen-north wrote:
Julito wrote:
Ok mate, just 1 link, but I first learned of it many years ago and shoved it into the general knowledge department. You can expand on it from here over one of your good vinos.
Scroll down to 1.... expulsion of... read on and hit the links. I didn't bother but it's a good place to start.

https://history.stackexchange.com/quest ... ish-empire


Thank you for the link, but so far I have failed to find any reference to what you wrote:

Julito wrote:Yes and the Spanish blew their Empire, they peed the money up against the wall buying titles for themselves, banning millinery in Spain ...



And I am not sure that 'culture' has any relation to it either.

https://books.google.cl/books?id=2ADTmE ... ts&f=false

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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby Julito » Sun Aug 27, 2017 1:32 pm

I read "...Veins of Latin America" when it was first published which the book reviewer describes as "full of emotion and myths". So perhaps that's where I got my millinery info from and it's one of those myths, because I can't find any alternate direct reference to it either.

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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby frozen-north » Sun Aug 27, 2017 2:45 pm

That sounds quite possible, as I found some rather vague comments on what might have been the economic impact on Spain caused by the expulsion of Jews, Moslems and Moriscos, as artisans and agricultural workforce. Also a comment on the possible impact of so many young people leaving for the American colonies. Still, in the context of all those wars, it might not have made too much difference.

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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby Julito » Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:14 pm

Possibly, but I'll leave that debate to the historians.

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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby Andres » Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:08 pm

Julito wrote:. . . And if the "lazy" lose out to the motivated, that's what happens everywhere.

That depends upon government 'policy'.
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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby Space Cat » Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:11 pm

admin wrote:They created a 'visitante' visa. Which, so far, looks like a 'jack of all trades, master of none' sort of visa to replace what essentially the tourist visa does now. No more being able to switch from tourist visa to some other visa. No more staying in the country indefinitely on renewed tourist visas.

Essentially, the 'visitante' visa would do that now. It is for up to one year. renewable for one more year. You can request work permission under it. It also allows for applying for temporary residency. suppose to be a catch-all, for pretty much everyone that is not a real tourist.

There is no explanation about who will issue this visa, where do you get it (e.g. consulate, airport, department of immigration, etc); but, in theory not a bad idea. Probably could use a different name, so as not to be confusing.

So does this mean declaring an immigration intention at some place before entering the country?

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Re: chile's migration crisis

Postby Andres » Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:23 pm

Admin

Your suggestions regarding immigration are too logical, sane, rational . . . will reduce the number of "snouts in the trough", and reduce the power of the bureaucrats . . . therefore it will never be adopted . . . no matter how beneficial it would be to the country.
Chile: My expectations are low. Very low.
I accept chaos. I'm not sure whether it accepts me.


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