Chile Forum

I'm a hiker, joining the forum to track fire news on Torres del Paine.

timecheck00 wrote:I'm a hiker, joining the forum to track fire news on Torres del Paine.

You're late. Fire is over. Next question.

Use the search function if you wish to review the history of the fire.

And welcome to the forum.

It appears there are nearly 3,000 registered members, and so far a one person intro here, great. I like the space.

I joined this forum partly because i got such a kick out of the framing pictures posted by patagoniax, and then i read the Monsanto thread, and was horrified. It felt like home after that.

I'm currently living at par in the number one performing economy in the world, and awake to the political storm clouds on yonder darkening horizon, i find myself looking more urgently than usual, for a real plan B. Hence i zeroed in on Chile via Internet, and then found this particularly interesting forum.

Glad to be aboard and promise to behave.

Welcome to the forum.

James-in-Wonderland wrote:... political storm clouds on yonder darkening horizon, i find myself looking more urgently than usual, for a real plan B. Hence i zeroed in on Chile via Internet,

Best to have not just Plan B, but C and D, and....Plan n . Just because Chile looks pretty this week because others are looking ugly is no assurance that the cuteness factor is sufficiently substantial. Remember that Chile is irretrievably Third World and inescapably Latin American, and in our half-lifetimes Chile has demonstrated on several occasions its ability to produce some abominably unpleasant governments.

El Chupacabra wrote:Welcome to the forum.

Thanks kindly. As veteran of the net, and running a few forums, i must say how much i like this place. A very interesting, polite, and respectful crowd of folks.

patagoniax wrote:
Best to have not just Plan B, but C and D, and....Plan n . Just because Chile looks pretty this week because others are looking ugly is no assurance that the cuteness factor is sufficiently substantial. Remember that Chile is irretrievably Third World and inescapably Latin American, and in our half-lifetimes Chile has demonstrated on several occasions its ability to produce some abominably unpleasant governments.

That's sage advice, especially in these times. I've lived in Central America for a year, plus three Caribbean countries. There are things i like about Latin culture, but of course there's two sides to that coin. Doors with 5 locks, ghettos, and the ever-present threat of being violently robbed could be the downside. I grasp your meaning 'irretrievably third world'. I'm really enjoying seeing Chile through the eyes of people here and especially those seasoned, without the rose-coloured spectacles. I was 25 years on the BC coast, and because i like the Latin culture to some extent, it seemed logical to look at Chile, the pacific coast, etc. So far nothing I've read here surprises me in the least, except maybe the food and drink comments.

My original plan B, for some years, has been Uruguay, where I've got an established network in place. However, the weather is not my cup of tea, and its getting more radical each year, it seems. In my case, I'm preparing for a worst-case scenario to hit North America, and by that i mean global conflict. I'm not sure what odds apply, but the potential negative energy is certainly building, and it seems the clock is ticking down to the inevitable. I'm rooted here at the moment, owning property that i would need to first divest of. Most of my liquid assets are in the yellow metal. But where to go? I've seen a good chunk of the world, and nothing is as comfortable as Canada. So I'm well versed in what i would be leaving behind. I have no wanderlust left, been there, done that. I'm simply looking for a comfortable SAFE surrounding in a temperate zone, far away from the madness that seems to have a death grip on the first world. I'm definitely open to suggestions. Despite all the short-comings I'm reading about here, I'm not striking Chile off the list. The geography of Chile is the most appealing thing I've read so far.

All the best!
James
(PS I have three 22 oz Estwings in my box and a couple of gas guns).

James-in-Wonderland wrote:I'm currently living at par in the number one performing economy in the world,

From your follow up post, do I deduce correctly that you are referring to Canada, J-i-W ? Our concern about returning there was it's proximity to the US, and slower growing (than the US) police state mentality. Also, too many wars and rumors of wars in the northern hemisphere.
Real estate is at a premium in Canada right now, correct? Might be the best time to cash out? Europe's cliff dive will hit Canada pretty hard.

Only 3 months in Chile now, but so glad to be here. Even with all it's faults, which we knew ahead of time thanks to this forum, what a difference from the dysfunctional mentality of the north, where you are either stressed out of your mind and "prepping" like a madman for armageddon, or pretending nothing is wrong. All the while, being literally robbed of wealth and freedom by elected officials, who continue to be elected! Not to mention constant surveillance of some sort - driving or walking on the street and via your tv, internet, cell phone, car and smart grid.
The constitution is de facto a dead letter. And everyone - even those who complain - has adjusted to this sick culture; thus, enables it.
Whew. Sorry for the vent. I'm still angry, and frustrated that many still ignore the obvious, including people I love.

Quirky forum, isn't it? from <ahem> tampon discourse to Monsanto. Entertaining and valuable.

California South wrote:Whew. Sorry for the vent. I'm still angry, and frustrated that many still ignore the obvious, including people I love.

Greetings C.S. You're venting to the choir! lol
Yup, i'm thoroughly Canadian, and i used to love the place - now i'm getting edgy, for the reason you point out. Btw, i live in a relatively small town which is overrun with police cars suddenly. Tonight on the way home at 9P i ran into a police check point deep in the residential neighbourhood i live in. First time ever i've seen such a thing here.

Yes, i'm thinking the same thing about RE values. I study the financial markets daily, like a hawk. I was trading for awhile last year. We're 3 years into a global depression, about to enter phase two. The G8 central banks are going to print and print. NATO is going to hit Iran. What happens next, is the part that has me motivated to get out of the way, far out of the way. Thanks for your encouraging comments about Chile, they are very welcome indeed.

.
Probably the wrong time and place and anyway we've discussed before: if/when TSHTF and the imagined worst case in EU/Asia/North America, where does that leave Chilito? With no markets. With no means to buy petroleum or other energy. Except for some subsistence farming, dead in the water. Can't eat copper ore. Chile imports almost everything but raw materials. Chile is a net food importer. Meat, grains, even fruit. Even Belgium, for crissake, is selling potato products to Chile, and its grains largely come from Canada. Oh, yes, did I mention periodic drought in Chile, and disappearing fish stocks? And Chile's current internal agricultural production and distribution relies entirely on foreign energy. About a 30-day supply at the moment. Remove that energy and the country goes hungry in, what, 60 days? Maybe less. Then all that superficial nicest-people-in-the-world crap goes away real fast. Parts of this country already show how they go lawless and self-destructive quickly over trivialities like the raising of heating gas prices (I got to personally participate in the military evacuations of thousands of foreigners from that one, but you'll never hear about it in the pollyanna histories). Ever seen a Santiago mob empty a grocery store in less than 20 minutes? And that's in The Best of Times. You probably don't remember the anti-American sentiment of the 1960s that is now re-igniting as anti-Canadian sentiment in some places over the same issues, the foreign ownership of mining concessions. You think that recent-history Frei and Allende takeovers of means of production in chilito were serious? Think again. In a global SHTF scenario, Chile is just another hungry, angry, lawless, Latinamerican backwater burning what's left of its furniture to stay warm. And you without a shotgun. Sorry.

patagoniax wrote:Just because Chile looks pretty this week because others are looking ugly is no assurance that the cuteness factor is sufficiently substantial. Remember that Chile is irretrievably Third World and inescapably Latin American, and in our half-lifetimes Chile has demonstrated on several occasions its ability to produce some abominably unpleasant governments.

My Aunts father was Minister of the Interior September 12,1924 to December 19, 1924. (Alcibiades Roland A). I was looking at a picture of him i/c a Luis Atamirano who was also Minister for September 5,1924 to September 12, 1924. I was at a loss as to why they had such short terms in office? A revolving government or what?

Snowman628 wrote:

My Aunts father was Minister of the Interior September 12,1924 to December 19, 1924. (Alcibiades Roland A). I was looking at a picture of him i/c a Luis Atamirano who was also Minister for September 5,1924 to September 12, 1924. I was at a loss as to why they had such short terms in office? A revolving government or what?

As you will recall, Sept 11, 1924 was the "other Sept 11" in Chilean history, when a military junta replaced the civilian government, and unsurprisingly the next day a lot of folks lost their cabinet positions. That junta was replaced not long after by another military government. In the 20th century, Chile had a history of unstable and short-lived governments, some with rather poor economic practices. Chile did not begin to develop sound and modern economic policies until after 1973.

As has often been the case in Chile, the military takeover of government in September of 1924 was an attempt to modernise the country and create economic and social reform. Even before the junta was formally created, the Chilean military threatened the recalcitrant legislature and was successful in bringing about labour and tax reforms, and even a rudimentary form of income tax to pay for much-needed government services, not least of which was the military. So your aunt's father was in fact part of a rather progressive military-backed administration which created improved legal processes, better working conditions, and even a sort of occupational safety programme which the civilian government had refused to adopt. Naturally, contemporary historians give short shrift to the many social, legal, and economic contributions of military governments in Chile, so if you attended public schools you were likely not exposed to any sort of objective view of Chilean history in this regard.

patagoniax wrote:

Snowman628 wrote:

My Aunts father was Minister of the Interior September 12,1924 to December 19, 1924. (Alcibiades Roland A). I was looking at a picture of him i/c a Luis Atamirano who was also Minister for September 5,1924 to September 12, 1924. I was at a loss as to why they had such short terms in office? A revolving government or what?

As you will recall, Sept 11, 1924 was the "other Sept 11" in Chilean history, when a military junta replaced the civilian government, and unsurprisingly the next day a lot of folks lost their cabinet positions. That junta was replaced not long after by another military government. In the 20th century, Chile had a history of unstable and short-lived governments, some with rather poor economic practices. Chile did not begin to develop sound and modern economic policies until after 1973.

As has often been the case in Chile, the military takeover of government in September of 1924 was an attempt to modernise the country and create economic and social reform. Even before the junta was formally created, the Chilean military threatened the recalcitrant legislature and was successful in bringing about labour and tax reforms, and even a rudimentary form of income tax to pay for much-needed government services, not least of which was the military. So your aunt's father was in fact part of a rather progressive military-backed administration which created improved legal processes, better working conditions, and even a sort of occupational safety programme which the civilian government had refused to adopt. Naturally, contemporary historians give short shrift to the many social, legal, and economic contributions of military governments in Chile, so if you attended public schools you were likely not exposed to any sort of objective view of Chilean history in this regard.

Thanks for the information, interesting times!