Chile Forum

Skraeling wrote:greg~judy

Having lived and worked in Canadistan for about 8 years now, I can tell you that the situation up north is very much as the complainant says. There have been two boatloads of Tamil Tigers and their families arrive in Vancouver who have been allowed to stay (even though Canada has named the Tigers as a terrorist organization). For example. Several years ago I read in a local paper in Ontario that there were several hundred known war criminals living in Canada.

It must be understood that officially and unofficially in Canada, the only bad people in the world are Americans. I know a few who disagree, but they are certainly in the minority. Anyone who disagrees is a right-wing nut. Of course.

Not that this has anything to do with Chile, and I have no dog in this fight since I don't live in Canada anymore, but there was discussion of this recently by the Toronto Sun:
For anyone not familiar with the group and their activities:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberation ... amil_Eelam
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2006/04/ ... ation.html
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2006/03/ ... 60315.html

Article carried by Toronto Sun:

Some die-hard Tamil Tigers fighters allegedly snuck into Canada on the ship that brought 492 migrants to British Columbia, according to a pro-Sri Lankan government website.

Their goal is to start a chapter of the dismantled terrorist group in Toronto, said LankaWeb, which runs a pro-Sri Lankan government articles from around the world.

The purpose of the MV Sun Sea journey this month was to raise money for the Tigers, which is considered a terror group in Canada, and smuggle fighters to Toronto so they can establish a cell, said an article on the website which was attributed to Sri Lanka United National Association of Canada.

The journey was “to gather the remnants of the Tamil Tiger fighting cadres in an asylum-granting liberal democracy such as Canada, and pursue the objective of carving out a separate state of ‘Eelam’ for Tamils in Sri Lanka,” said the article.

“The Canadian pro-Tigers disapora is the largest and most active segment in the world.”

It alleged the group’s supporters in Toronto will profit from the journey, which they helped set up by enlisting migrants who paid up to $50,000 for the trip.

David Poopalapillai, of the Canadian Tamil Congress, countered any potential members of the Tigers who hid among the migrants will be intercepted by the RCMP or an Immigration and Refugee Board.

The migrants are being detained while the Mounties and CSIS conduct security checks.

“The system has checks and balances in place,” Poopalapillai said Monday from B.C. “It has the ability and capabality to weed out these people if they’re inadmissable.”

He said 10 more women appeared before an adjudicator on Monday and all are being detained until their identities have been confirmed.

Poopalapillai said community members are ready to raise thousands of dollars to pay for bonds that will be required for the release of the migrants.

He said the migrants are in good shape and being well-treated by police and border officials.

LankaWeb said Tamil women are being smuggled into Canada to increase their dowry value on arranged marriages to partners back home. There were 60 women and 30 children among the Sun Sea migrants.

“A Tamil family in Colombo cannot match the riches of a Tamil family in Toronto,“ said LankaWeb.

The site said parents are forced to send their daughters or sisters abroad to earn a hefty dowry when they get married. A woman who is a Canadian citizen is worth more in dowry since she can sponsor a husband, community members said.

Nullius wrote:

GJJIM wrote:

greg~judy wrote:

street~art804 sm.jpg

That which does not kill us, only makes us stronger. literally:

I was meaning to comment on this but found it difficult to do so without sounding snarky.

The original “Aus der Kriegsschule des Lebens.- Was mich nicht umbringt, macht mich stärker.” Nietzsche: " Twilight of the Idols or How to Philosophize With a Hammer."

Often translated close to the original as "What doesn't kill me, makes me stronger," the quote was a famous and popular axiom of the Nazis' Third Reich, though that is hardly Nietzsche's fault. In a loose and figurative sense, the expression can support a cultural purpose (e.g., “Life is nothing but suffering. We must learn to cope with it.”) This of course differs from the present maxim, "Life occasionally involves suffering and this must always be blamed on someone who has a lot of money."

Although there are some limited (accent on the "limited") applications in medicine, the literal expression is regarded as a classic in logical fallacy. For example, literally ingesting 5 mg of lead dust or partially depleted uranium every day might not literally kill you immediately, but it is difficult to see how this might make you literally stronger.

The origins of common phrases are fascinating, and I thank you for that background information. If you're not already familiar with it, look into the original meaning of "by and large".

My original (and largely OT) comment concerned the ingestion of trace minerals in water. Current government "wisdom" is to mandate that water suppliers reduce the levels of contaminants like arsenic and selenium to essentially zero, no matter what the cost. This flies in the face of decades of biological research that indicates a definite hormesis effect where mortality increases as the level of toxins approaches zero. Ingesting trace amounts of toxins (that which does not kill us) has been demonstrated to increase average lifespans (makes us stronger). As with most things there are limits, and in the graph of mortality versus toxin level, the line does trend upward at some point. Your argument above that mentions milligram quantities of Pb and U is specious, as this would be the equivalent of ingesting millions or billions of times the amount of contaminants found in water. I don't know anyone that drinks ten thousand liters of water a day.

That which does not kill us, only makes us stronger. literally:

I don't see how any reasonable person could interpret this literally as universal or axiomatic. To yield a true outcome the proposition would have to be highly conditioned, and plausible exceptions are simply too easy and obvious (including those previously offered). This brings to mind how certain university instructors could waste an entire class period, baiting students with dubious but provocative nonsense, only to have everyone concede at the end of the hour that under some limited conditions the proposition could be true.

Poster Nullius expressed a desire to avoid the appearance of snarkiness in debate, and I could not agree more.

It may be worthwhile to understand what was happening in Nietzsche's life when he wrote that opinion, and what sort of metaphorical message he was trying to communicate. That is, we should examine the context.

During much of his life Nietzsche suffered from a variety of illnesses, including mental illness. In his writings we observe messages that are parallel to the famous "only makes me stronger" quotation. There seems to be little doubt that the famous saying grew out of Nietzsche's anguish, and his determination to overcome his suffering and continue to work, believing that the impact of his illnesses had the effect of making him work harder. Others have interpreted this to mean that work produced when one has suffered has some sort of greater intrinsic virtue. Thus we believe that Nietzsche did not mean that he was made physically stronger or healthier by his misfortune. Rather, he believed that in his case alone, and not as a universal result, that the unique personal experience of overcoming his particular set of challenges had contributed to his becoming a better performer. Did his writings on his experience inspire others? Certainly.

If anyone is sufficiently familiar with the life and times and philosophies of Friedrich Nietzsche to be able to shed more light on the contextual intent of this famous "makes me stronger" metaphor, I for one would welcome such a contribution.

I am late to the party but I actually have something to add. Remember that crazy American kid who tried to blow up some hotel in Bolivia with his Uruguayan girlfriend? He did his travels in and out of Argentina, Uruguay and Bolivia on a world service organization passport.

Correction, world service authority passport. Here's the link: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/ ... 2043.shtml

Ripsigg wrote:Correction, world service authority passport. Here's the link: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/ ... 2043.shtml

Good catch. Just had to look that one up, just for amusement value. This is great theatre.

World passport.... Not recognised in North America, but might be able to get into Ecuador on one. The issuing folks claim that on a few occasions their passport has been accepted by Chile and 150 or so other countries http://www.worldgovernment.org/visas.html?s=1

Wikipedia and the Canadian Immigration and Refugee board and others:

The World Passport is a document issued by the World Service Authority, a non-profit organization founded by Garry Davis in 1948, citing Article 13, Section 2, of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. World Passports have reportedly been accepted on a de facto, case-by-case basis by over 150 countries (i.e. they have been stamped with a national visa or entry or exit stamp) and, at one time or another, on an explicit, legal or de jure basis by Burkina Faso, Ecuador, Mauritania, Tanzania, Togo and Zambia. However, Burkina Faso withdrew its de jure recognition of World Passports in 1992, and Zambia has also reportedly withdrawn its recognition. Immigration authorities in Canada, New Zealand, Switzerland and the United States have stated that they do not recognize such documents because they are not issued by a competent government authority, and thus do not meet the definition of a passport. The latest edition of the World Passport, issued January 2007, is an MRD (machine readable document) with an alphanumeric code bar enabling computer input plus an embedded "ghost" photo for security, printing covered with a plastic film.

World passports have been issued "honourarily" to the Dalai Lama, Archbishop Desmond Tutu and Jean-Bertrand Aristide. As well, the WSA makes ten passports available to refugees for every $300 contribution to its World Refugee Fund.

According to Citizenship and Immigration Canada, International Services Group, no document issued by the WSA is acceptable for either travel or identity purposes (20 Oct. 1995). This Response was prepared after researching publicly accessible information currently available to the DIRB within time constraints. This Response is not, and does not purport to be, conclusive as to the merit of any particular claim to refugee status or asylum.

Similarly, NZ says:
Holders of the following travel documents are not recognised: Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, Maori Kingdom of Teteti Islands, United Nations Transitional Administration for East Timor (UNTAET), World Service Authority & holders of certain passports issued in former USSR

And the guy who dreamed up the World Passport?

A peace activist named Garry Davis created the WSA in 1953 and traveled around the world using the first world passport ever issued. (The organization says they've issued more than a half-million world passports since then.) Davis, a former World War II bomber pilot, had renounced his U.S. citizenship in 1948 and gained notoriety by picketing the fledgling United Nations in Paris. He argued that free travel was a fundamental human right and that world peace required a global government as opposed to a system of nation-states.

He took his first trip on the world passport in 1956, from New York to Bombay. Davis told a New York Times reporter that the Indian customs official seemed confused but stamped it just the same. He would later use the passport to enter Pakistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia, and Switzerland.

The passport didn't always work, and Davis found himself in jail dozens of times. He's also been convicted of fraud for selling the world passport, and some have accused the WSA of making money off of refugees or would-be emigrants.


---------- regarding the 2006 article....

The Washington, D.C.-based World Service Authority, a human rights advocacy group that issues "world passports," identified the suspect as Triston Jay Amero -- who used the name "Lestat Claudius de Orleans" taken from the story Interview with a Vampire --- and said he had sought to renounce his U.S. citizenship after getting into trouble with the law in his home state of California.

Ah, California. Now we understand.

He was in and out of mental institutions before he hit the road to Colombia and other countries. Evo Morales accused the CIA of bombing the guesthouse and that this Amero guy was working for the CIA until even Morales realized that this guy had a few screws loose.

This Amero guy was posting on the internet about his travels. He does claim in postings that he was stamped into Uruguay on it and also into Argentina. His internet ravings were the ravings of a disturbed person so I don't know what to say about his claims.