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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby greg~judy » Mon May 24, 2010 9:04 pm

This perverse "police state" tidbit is worth a BUMP...
Does this make ya feel warm/fuzzy/secure... :?
Or does this piss ya off as to wanton waste & inefficiency... :twisted:
g~j are happy we don't pay taxes for this BS... :D
g~j are happy we will never fly thru Am'urk'n airspace/ports :alien:
$200m 'behaviour detection' officers fail to spot a single terrorist at airports

A team of more than 3,000 "behaviour detection" officers hired to spot terrorists at US airports have failed to catch a single person despite costing the taxpayer $200 million (£140 million) last year.
The specially-trained officers patrol terminals monitoring passengers for suspicious body language and facial expressions.

Since 2006, the officers have been stationed at more than 160 airports across the US in order to provide a hidden measure of security.

But 16 people accused of being part of terrorist plots have passed through US airports undetected a total of 23 times since 2004 - a number of them since the scheme was started - according to an investigation by the Government Accountability Office.

Earlier this year, officials at the Transportation Security Administration (TSA), which runs the behaviour detection programme, asked US Congress to expand the scheme, which is known as Spot - Screening Passengers by Observation Techniques.

John Mica, a Republican congressman from Florida who was involved in setting up the TSA in response to the Sept 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, said it had become too bureaucratic.

He said the report into behaviour detection would further call into question the agency's ability to perform its security mission.

The TSA said the programme is a "vital layer of security based in science", which has led to more than 1,700 arrests for other crimes like drug smuggling.

However, a 2008 report by a team at the National Academy of Sciences said "behavioural surveillance" had "enormous potential for violating privacy" and there was no evidence it worked.

The report said a person behaving oddly could just as easily be planning an extramarital affair as a terrorist attack.

Stephen Fienberg, a professor at Carnegie Mellon University, described the programme as a "sham". By 2008, around 160,000 people had been selected to be interviewed or given further pat downs based on the behaviour detection technique but less than one per cent of those were arrested.

Charles Slepian, and aviation security analyst, said the failure of the programme to catch a terrorist was a "disgrace." He told CBS News: "If it worked, you would catch them."
“Most ignorance is vincible ignorance.
We don’t know because we don’t want to know.”

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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby FrankPintor » Mon May 24, 2010 10:49 pm

If you're interested in reading this kind of stuff, you need to follow http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travel-s ... urity-222/, and even better, Blogdad Bob's rebuttal efforts on http://blog.tsa.gov/. It makes for an amazing soap opera (as long as you can watch from a safe distance), and longer running than anything since the "Sullivans".
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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby admin » Mon May 24, 2010 11:37 pm

Yea, my academic background is in Philosophy of mind and language. We spend a lot of time poking at the social sciences including behavioral psychology. Guess what, that has about as much scientific validity as reading a crystal ball. In fact, I think a better investment would be a crystal ball. At least then they would have an unbiased random sampling to work off when they pull someone aside for questioning.

It is the same basic reason that lie detectors are unreliable. If lie detectors are unreliable or can be defeated when someone is hooked to a machine, why would someone just eyeballing someone else from across a crowded room be any more valid or reliable?
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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby GJJIM » Tue May 25, 2010 12:13 pm

Benjamin Franklin warned us to never confuse motion with action. When the federal government spends money, hires lots of people, and sets a fuzzy goal, we have the perfect example of useless motion -- lots of sound and fury but nothing is accomplished.
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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby Ripsigg » Tue May 25, 2010 7:45 pm

If I am not mistaken, the original post dealt with that American born Al Qaeda member now in Yemen. He is the first US citizen on the CIA's capture or shoot list. Anyways, I saw an interesting hour long report on him on Fox News the other night. The Fox News program was intended to flame Americans against this guy and be thankful to the CIA but after watching the program, I was left wondering what the guy did wrong.

It was an hour long program highlighting how evil the man was, including how he visited prostitutes and had personally met other terrorists. How he came first to the US on a J1 visa and then later got a US passport based on his birth in New Mexico. About the only real crime they could accuse him of was miswriting his birthplace on his social security card application. He later corrected in social security records. Now he is on the CIA shoot or capture list.

I certainly don't agree with what he says about Americans and I certainly would get in a fist fight with him if I saw him. I find his opinions deplorable, period. He believes in ridiculous beliefs and he is a crude hypocrite, but if being a hyprocrite and believing in ridiculous beliefs were crimes, most church goers in the US would be in jail.
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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby GJJIM » Tue May 25, 2010 10:15 pm

Ripsigg wrote: About the only real crime they could accuse him of was miswriting his birthplace on his social security card application. He later corrected in social security records. Now he is on the CIA shoot or capture list.


This whole thing pisses me off and illustrates how far the pendulum has swung. Like it or not, he is a U.S. citizen. A bureaucrat in the executive branch testified to Congress that he thinks he has the authority to impose a death sentence on U.S. citizens living in foreign countries without any review by courts, either here or over there! When "technical means" are used to carry out the execution, that death sentence apparently also applies to any hapless bystanders unfortunate enough to be in the vicinity when the missile explodes. Rather than calling in the Sgt. at Arms and having the guy arrested on the spot, the clueless Congressmen sat there and nodded.

The "American terrorist" may indeed be a dirtbag worthy of hanging, but we're supposed to follow the rules of due process.
Last edited by GJJIM on Tue May 25, 2010 10:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby greg~judy » Tue May 25, 2010 10:22 pm

... but if being a hyprocrite and believing in ridiculous beliefs were crimes, most church goers in the US would be in jail.

AMEN, brother... AMEN :lol: :lol: :lol:
“Most ignorance is vincible ignorance.
We don’t know because we don’t want to know.”

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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby chix001 » Wed May 26, 2010 11:14 am

g~j, you took the words right out of my mouth, LOL
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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby Brasstacks » Fri Jul 16, 2010 7:49 am

I was a foreign student in the US in the 1960's. Saw a lot of dramatics concerning the Vietnam War,Black Panthers,Watergate,VP Spiro Agnew, and John Lennon.I have not been back to the US in over 30 years.After reading this post,it is unlikely that I will ever return for a holiday.

Some years ago, I was returning from Austria via Germany to Paris. When I crossed the border at Salzburg, everything seemed to be fine.In about ten minutes a big green van speeded in front of me and then started to slow down.I honestly thought I was being car jacked.My car was an underpowered OPAL.I gave a turn signal and the van at once shifted into my path. Then a big red sign appeared.POLICE STOP ( in German).I followed the van. I tell you,hysteria followed. I think the customs and immigration control were bored that day.Everyone jumped out of the van and surrounded me. I must admit they cooled down when I showed them my Irish passport and started to speak English. I asked why I was being controled.They told me the truth.I had the profile of a Islamic from Turkey.I guess they saw that I was wearing a coat and tie,had dark hair and was driving a OPAL.Germany is only one millimeter behind the US when it comes to civil rights infractions.France is also one millimeter behind Germany.
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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby greg~judy » Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:35 pm

g~j are on a bit of a roll tonite...
Here's a good one for ya...
Be careful with that camera, eh? :lol:
Ya might just be able to sue some nice police state and get a nice reward... :mrgreen:

One afternoon, Duane P. Kerzic was arrested by the Amtrak police while taking pictures of a train pulling into Pennsylvania Station. At first, the police asked him to delete the images from his camera, but he refused. He ended up handcuffed to the wall of a holding cell while an officer wrote a ticket for trespassing.

Mr. Kerzic, a semiprofessional photographer, proceeded to describe his detention on his Web site and included images of the summons. He also hired a lawyer to sue.

In due course, Stephen Colbert of “The Colbert Report” arrived to sound the gong. He turned the Kerzic story into a segment called “Nailed ’Em.” It mocked Amtrak without mercy.

Finally,” Mr. Colbert reported, “Kerzic cracked and revealed the reason he was taking his terrifying photos.”

Mr. Kerzic appeared on the screen.

The reason I was taking photos of trains is that every year Amtrak has a contest; it’s called ‘Picture Our Train,’ ” he explained.

Soon after the show was broadcast, a strange thing happened. The section of Mr. Kerzic’s Web site that dealt with Amtrak all but vanished. His lawsuit was settled, and as a condition of the deal, he had to remove his writings about the episode. Now his page on Amtrak — at duanek.name/Amtrak/ — contains two words: “No Comment!”

Mr. Kerzic and his lawyer, Gerald Cohen, both said they couldn’t talk about what had become of the Web pages describing the arrest and his commentary about it. Carlos Miller, a photographer and blogger who followed the case, reported that Mr. Kerzic received a “five-figure” settlement.

But how could Amtrak — the national railroad, whose preferred stock is owned by the American public and whose chief executive and board of directors are appointed by the president and confirmed by Congress — require that a Web site criticizing the railroad be shut down as a condition of settling a lawsuit for wrongful arrest?

What qualifications does Amtrak have to function as a censor?

“Our policy has been and continues to be that ‘Amtrak does not comment on civil case settlements,’ ”Clifford Cole, an Amtrak spokesman, said in an e-mail message. “We would not have any more to say on this matter.”

Since 9/11, a number of government bodies have sought to limit photography in railroad stations and other public buildings. One rationale is that pictures would help people planning acts of mayhem. It has been a largely futile effort. On a practical level, decent cameras now come in every size and shape, and controlling how people use them would require legions of police officers. Moreover, taking photographs and displaying them is speech protected by the First Amendment, no less than taking notes and writing them up.

LAST year, a man named Robert Taylor was arrested on a nearly empty subway platform in the Bronx, accused of illegally taking pictures. For good measure, the officer threw in a disorderly conduct charge, on the grounds that Mr. Taylor was blocking people’s movement, even though it was the middle of the afternoon, the platform was about 10,000 square feet and there was hardly anyone around. The charges were dismissed, and the city paid Mr. Taylor $30,000 for his trouble. The city had already paid $31,501 to a medical student who was arrested while he was shooting pictures of every train station in the city.

After Mr. Taylor’s case, the New York Police Department reminded officers that there was no ban on taking pictures in the subway system.

In November, Antonio Musumeci, a member of the Manhattan Libertarian Party, was given a ticket while videotaping a political protest in the plaza outside the federal courthouse in Lower Manhattan. Citing a federal regulation that dates to 1957, agents of the Federal Protective Service gave Mr. Musumeci a summons as he recorded a man who was handing pamphlets to potential jurors. The New York Civil Liberties Union has filed a lawsuit on Mr. Musumeci’s behalf, arguing that the rules that govern photography on federal property were vague and unconstitutional. The lawsuit says people routinely take pictures on the plaza after new citizens are sworn in at the courthouse.

Since Mr. Kerzic’s run-in with the police at Penn Station, Amtrak has dropped its Web page on the “Picture Our Trains” contest.

Mr. Colbert wasn’t standing for it.

“This photography contest,” he said, “is Amtrak’s cleverest ruse since their so-called timetable.”
“Most ignorance is vincible ignorance.
We don’t know because we don’t want to know.”

↑↑↑ aldous huxley ↓↓↓
“There are things known and there are things unknown,
and in between are the doors of perception.”
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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby greg~judy » Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:46 am

Try this one on for size, police state lovers...
Say what? ...I can't hear you :roll:

High Court Trims Miranda Warning Rights Bit by Bit

You have the right to remain silent, but only if you tell the police that you're remaining silent.

You have a right to a lawyer — before, during and after questioning, even though the police don't have to tell you exactly when the lawyer can be with you. If you can't afford a lawyer, one will be provided to you. Do you understand these rights as they have been read to you, which, by the way, are only good for the next two weeks?

The Supreme Court made major revisions to the now familiar Miranda warnings this year. The rulings will change the ways police, lawyers and criminal suspects interact amid what experts call an attempt to pull back some of the rights that Americans have become used to over recent decades.

The high court has made clear it's not going to eliminate the requirement that police officers give suspects a Miranda warning, so it is tinkering around the edges, said Jeffrey L. Fisher, co-chair of the amicus committee of the National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers.

"It's death by a thousand cuts," Fisher said. "For the past 20-25 years, as the court has turned more conservative on law and order issues, it has been whittling away at Miranda and doing everything it can to ease the admissibility of confessions that police wriggle out of suspects."

The court placed limits on the so-called Miranda rights three times during the just-ended session. Experts viewed the large number of rulings as a statistical aberration, rather than a full-fledged attempt to get rid of the famous 1966 decision. The original ruling emerged from police questioning of Ernesto Miranda in a rape and kidnapping case in Phoenix. It required officers to tell suspects taken into custody that they have the right to remain silent and to have a lawyer represent them, even if they can't afford one.

The court's three decisions "indicate a desire to prune back the rules somewhat," Kent Scheidegger, the legal director of the Criminal Justice Legal Foundation, a victims' rights group. "But I don't think any overruling of Miranda is in the near future. I think that controversy is pretty much dead."

The Supreme Court in 2000 upheld the requirement that the Miranda warning be read to criminal suspects.

This year's Supreme Court decisions did not mandate changes in the wording of Miranda warnings read by arresting police officers. The most common version is now familiar to most Americans, thanks to television police shows: "You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law. You have the right to speak to an attorney. If you cannot afford an attorney, one will be appointed to you. Do you understand these rights as they have been read to you?"

However, the court did approve one state version of the Miranda warnings that did not specifically inform suspects that they had a right to have a lawyer present during their police questioning.

The Miranda warning used in parts of Florida told suspects: "You have the right to talk to a lawyer before answering any of our questions. If you cannot afford to hire a lawyer, one will be appointed for you without cost and before any questioning. You have the right to use any of these rights at any time you want during this interview."

Lawyers — and the Florida Supreme Court — said that didn't make clear that lawyers can be present as the police are doing their questioning. But Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg, writing the 7-2 majority decision, said all the required information was there.

"Nothing in the words used indicated that counsel's presence would be restricted after the questioning commenced," Ginsburg said. "Instead, the warning communicated that the right to counsel carried forward to and through the interrogation."

The next day, the court unanimously limited how long Miranda rights are valid.

The high court said for the first time that a suspect's request for a lawyer is good for only 14 days after the person is released from police custody. The 9-0 ruling pulled back from an earlier decision that said that police must halt all questioning for all time if a suspect asks for a lawyer.

Police can now attempt to question a suspect who asked for a lawyer — once the person has been released from custody for at least two weeks — without violating the person's constitutional rights and without having to repeat the Miranda warning.

"In our judgment, 14 days will provide plenty of time for the suspect to get reacclimated to his normal life, to consult with friends and counsel and to shake off any residual coercive effects of his prior custody," said Justice Antonin Scalia, who wrote the majority opinion.

And finally, the court's conservatives used their 5-4 advantage to rule that suspects must break their silence and tell police they are going to remain quiet if they want to invoke their "right to remain silent" and stop an interrogation, just as they must tell police that they want a lawyer.

All the criminal suspect needs to say is he or she is remaining silent, wrote Justice Anthony Kennedy. "Had he made either of these simple, unambiguous statements, he would have invoked his 'right to cut off questioning.' Here he did neither, so he did not invoke his right to remain silent."

But Justice Sonia Sotomayor said the majority's decision "turns Miranda upside down."

"Criminal suspects must now unambiguously invoke their right to remain silent — which counter intuitively requires them to speak," she said. "At the same time, suspects will be legally presumed to have waived their rights even if they have given no clear expression of their intent to do so."

Police officers will look at these decisions and incorporate them into their training, said James Pasco of the National Fraternal Order of Police. "Officers are expected to adapt to changes required by the Supreme Court," Pasco said. "This will be no different."

But Fisher thinks the court's Miranda decisions will make it easier for police to get confessions out of people who don't want to confess. "Those decisions open up ways for cops to work around Miranda," Fisher said.
“Most ignorance is vincible ignorance.
We don’t know because we don’t want to know.”

↑↑↑ aldous huxley ↓↓↓
“There are things known and there are things unknown,
and in between are the doors of perception.”
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Re: Feb. 3rd 2010. It's Official, U.S.A. a Police State

Postby MikieO » Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:40 pm

http://www.investors.com/NewsAndAnalysi ... tion-.aspx
Will Washington's Failures Lead To Second American Revolution?

By ERNEST S. CHRISTIAN AND GARY A ROBBINS 07/30/2010

The Internet is a large-scale version of the "Committees of Correspondence" that led to the first American Revolution — and with Washington's failings now so obvious and awful, it may lead to another.

People are asking, "Is the government doing us more harm than good? Should we change what it does and the way it does it?"

Pruning the power of government begins with the imperial presidency.

Too many overreaching laws give the president too much discretion to make too many open-ended rules controlling too many aspects of our lives. There's no end to the harm an out-of-control president can do.

Bill Clinton lowered the culture, moral tone and strength of the nation — and left America vulnerable to attack. When it came, George W. Bush stood up for America, albeit sometimes clumsily.

Barack Obama, however, has pulled off the ultimate switcheroo: He's diminishing America from within — so far, successfully.

He may soon bankrupt us and replace our big merit-based capitalist economy with a small government-directed one of his own design.

He is undermining our constitutional traditions: The rule of law and our Anglo-Saxon concepts of private property hang in the balance. Obama may be the most "consequential" president ever.

The Wall Street Journal's steadfast Dorothy Rabinowitz wrote that Barack Obama is "an alien in the White House."

His bullying and offenses against the economy and job creation are so outrageous that CEOs in the Business Roundtable finally mustered the courage to call him "anti-business." Veteran Democrat Sen. Max Baucus blurted out that Obama is engineering the biggest government-forced "redistribution of income" in history.

Fear and uncertainty stalk the land. Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke says America's financial future is "unusually uncertain."

A Wall Street "fear gauge" based on predicted market volatility is flashing long-term panic. New data on the federal budget confirm that record-setting deficits in the $1.4 trillion range are now endemic.

Obama is building an imperium of public debt and crushing taxes, contrary to George Washington's wise farewell admonition: "cherish public credit ... use it as sparingly as possible ... avoiding likewise the accumulation of debt ... bear in mind, that towards the payment of debts there must be Revenue, that to have Revenue there must be taxes; that no taxes can be devised, which are not ... inconvenient and unpleasant ... ."

Opinion polls suggest that in the November mid-term elections, voters will replace the present Democratic majority in Congress with opposition Republicans — but that will not necessarily stop Obama.

A President Obama intent on achieving his transformative goals despite the disagreement of the American people has powerful weapons within reach. In one hand, he will have a veto pen to stop a new Republican Congress from repealing ObamaCare and the Dodd-Frank takeover of banks.

In the other, he will have a fistful of executive orders, regulations and Obama-made fiats that have the force of law.

Under ObamaCare, he can issue new rules and regulations so insidiously powerful in their effect that higher-priced, lower-quality and rationed health care will quickly become ingrained, leaving a permanent stain.

Under Dodd-Frank, he and his agents will control all credit and financial transactions, rewarding friends and punishing opponents, discriminating on the basis of race, gender and political affiliation. Credit and liquidity may be choked by bureaucracy and politics — and the economy will suffer.

He and the EPA may try to impose by "regulatory" fiats many parts of the cap-and-trade and other climate legislation that failed in the Congress.

And by executive orders and the in terrorem effect of an industrywide "boot on the neck" policy, he can continue to diminish energy production in the United States.

By the trick of letting current-law tax rates "expire," he can impose a $3.5 trillion 10-year tax increase that damages job-creating capital investment in an economy struggling to recover. And by failing to enforce the law and leaving America's borders open, he can continue to repopulate America with unfortunate illegals whose skill and education levels are low and whose political attitudes are often not congenial to American-style democracy.

A wounded rampaging president can do much damage — and, like Caesar, the evil he does will live long after he leaves office, whenever that may be.

The overgrown, un-pruned power of the presidency to reward, punish and intimidate may now be so overwhelming that his re-election in 2012 is already assured — Chicago-style.

• Christian, an attorney, was a deputy assistant secretary of the Treasury in the Ford administration.

• Robbins, an economist, served at the Treasury Department in the Reagan administration.

--
I'm looking forward to sitting this out with a stash of 120.... :alien:
As for the Bush part about him being "clumsy" ... words fail me :shock:
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