Chile Forum

I lived in Arica for nine months and I thought it was pretty safe. Not much crime to speak of, really.

[rant]
g~j must comment here...
Considering this original post was grasping at tenuous straws about 16 months ago...
AND... considering the original poster's question was quite adequately addressed by several astute and knowledgeable allchilleans.
g~j consider the bump of the topic is somewhat perverse...
(or as eeuu might say... Bullshit)
But, hey... free speech, eh? - WTF?
Why the desire to dredge the depths of old dead posts?

in the other hand, seriously, i dont like arica. but not for bolivians, in summer time you will see many bolivian high class people going there, and they are no way indigenous, they are mostly germanics. better looking than peruvians and locals. and dont take the arican guy seriously he is a little bit jingoistic about his city. you can check iquique to me one of the best places to live in chile. modern, good beach, taxless zone, good reastaurants, etc. and sadly there are drugaddicts in all chile despiting colonia dignidad.

To practice English is one thing... please continue to progress in your language acquisition.
No worries about mistakes, spelling, grammar... we can all accept and understand a good effort.
But one must be careful of content and ideas.
Is this now about drugs in Arica (or anywhere else)...?
The comparisons made of drug use in other S.A. countries are arguably valid...
But then to continue with racist comments about - Bolivians - Peruvians - Germanics - indigenous?
And the pathetic slur on "the Arican guy"... considered "jingoistic" and not to be taken seriously?
Such statements are both odious and unnecessary.
This thread should die a peaceful death - as should have happened back in March 2009?
[/rant over]

I don't know why this thread was dredged up either, but I was very interested in Arica when I asked about drug addicts in my original post. As it had been noted, Arica has little going on business wise, and is a summer tourist destination. So very possible that drugs are a problem. I made the mistake of mentioning in an Ecuador related Yahoo Group that I felt Chile would be a better situation for me and got a bunch of very negative emails from a member who jealously defended all things Ecuador. That was one of her claims about Arica, so I asked. As I recall, you took umbrage at my criticizing the Obama administration so maybe that's the basis of your remarks here.

As I recall, you took umbrage at my criticizing the Obama administration so maybe that's the basis of your remarks here.

You must have g~j confused with someone else...?
We don't believe we have ever crossed any epistemological swords with you
There may be no more vociferous critic of the aforementioned psychopathic entity than g~j

Regardless... this is a tangent - lots of other threads for such "entertainment", eh?
Thanks for checking in vanman...
But as your original question has been laid to rest...
And as it seems the only perverse purpose (for any), will be to continue dissing, or bashing, or comparing "this place" with "that place" with "any place"... drug addicts notwithstanding...
Which will open up all kinds of ugly-worm-cans of opinionated controversy and dissension...

g~j repeat again...

This thread should die a peaceful death - as should have happened back in March 2009?

Either that, of change the name of the thread - it serves no more useful purpose, unless there is a valid reason to continue a comparative analysis of drug use and drug addicts in ALL Chilean cities?
In which case... we need FACTS - not allusions and hearsay.

BTW... g~j must now go to prepare a hit of our favorite (morning) stimulant drug of choice...
Followed in the afternoon~evening by our other daily doses of liquid depressants...
And don't forget any other obligate neuro-chemical pharmaceutical mood-alterants, of course...
Nor any combustible drugs that might potentially enter into the fray (legal, or otherwise)...?
We remain, along with many, "drug addicts"...
May all be well and happy, with their own drug choices

When I first came to Chile in the 80s, I crossed over from Tacna. The the sense of safety back then was as palpable as the need to look over my shoulder constantly since crossing the border with Mexico a couple years earlier. In Ecuador I tired of extreme measures to keep the parasites off of me. Though I will say it is a gorgeous country with some really wonderful people. In 5 years traveling in Latin America, I found Chile to be easily the most livable in many respects.

Skipping years ahead. A couple years ago in Arica, My vehicle was literally ripped into by a carload of drugged maniacs, AT 2:00 PM, in front of myself and dozens of other beach goers. Unbelievable! The locals knew who they were, what neighborhood they lived in, and laughed that I thought I might go looking for them with the Pacos. Who regretted not being interested in doing anything when I made a "constancia". Apparently it was my lack prudence, and I guess it was.

I've lived in Pichilemu for 20 years, and have had some problems too. S happens over the years anywhere. But the incidence, and attitude, toward crime is way different, for the worse, in my mind in Northern Chile. It is still safer in our corner here, but I don't know for how long.
The first four administrations since free elections have only been Enablers in the decline in security. Perhaps the conservatives can do better. But the problem now runs deep. respect is not in vogue in many demographics.

For me. Drugs, an absurd defacto impunity for minors and pathetic parenting is behind it.

I am not much interested in holly wars on what place is better or silly discussions on personal anecdotes -things who happen almos daily in Chile and everywere- Just for informative purposes I will mention that the most respected study on crime in Chile is the so called "Encuesta de Victimizacion" made by Adimark and Fundacion Paz Ciudadana, which is based in representative samples all over the country instead of mere dennounces in the police the crime in cities from more to less (July 2009) are:

City % victimizacion
Concepcion 44
Puerto Montt 41.1
Gran Santiago 38.7
Curico 37.9
Valparaiso 37.1
Antofagasta 35.4
Iquique 34.7
Temuco 33.4
Copiapo 33.1
Rancagua 31.8
Valdivia 30.5
Viña del Mar 29.3
Talca 28.8
Arica 28.1
La Serena 27.4
Osorno 25.4
Punta Arenas 14.3

Arica used to be the 2nd safer after Punta Arenas, in this survey (July 2009) falled to 4th, still is one of the safest, les than 30% victimizacion is considered quite safe.

Anyway there is a marked correlation between the population and victimizacion so, the less people come to Arica the safer will remain

Good one Tomas...
Let's kick it around a bit more...
The local rag - La Estrella Arica - today announces that a 73 year old Japanese grandfather was arrested at Chacalluta airport with 5kg of coke in his suitcase.
On his way to Santiago... then out of the country
Hmmm...
If we remember the basic statistics of those they catch vs. those they don't... (mas o menos 5-10%)
i.e. for every ONE they catch... there are probably 18-19 who are successful.
Wow... gotta be LOTS of drugs going to the south - whether from Arica...
Or arguably elsewhere from Peru, or Bolivia... by land borders, or by air.
Seems to g~j that there's probably a lot of "drug addicts" in Santiago and environs...eh?
Most folks around XV Region these days are too damn poor to afford drugs and get addicted...
Try Iquique and Antofagasta with all the mining infrastructure and attendant money???
Saw another headline from the Iquique rag today - pisteleros robbing a farmacia for drugs~money.
And thus it continues beyond - to all those "los ricos" up South
Who need to feed their monkeys
All the pots up south have no basis calling the kettles to the north anything- especially "black"

tombrad2 wrote:I am not much interested in holly wars on what place is better or silly discussions on personal anecdotes -things who happen almos daily in Chile and everywere- Just for informative purposes I will mention that the most respected study on crime in Chile is the so called "Encuesta de Victimizacion" made by Adimark and Fundacion Paz Ciudadana, which is based in representative samples all over the country instead of mere dennounces in the police the crime in cities from more to less (July 2009) are:

City % victimizacion
Concepcion 44
Puerto Montt 41.1
Gran Santiago 38.7
Curico 37.9
Valparaiso 37.1
Antofagasta 35.4
Iquique 34.7
Temuco 33.4
Copiapo 33.1
Rancagua 31.8
Valdivia 30.5
Viña del Mar 29.3
Talca 28.8
Arica 28.1
La Serena 27.4
Osorno 25.4
Punta Arenas 14.3

Arica used to be the 2nd safer after Punta Arenas, in this survey (July 2009) falled to 4th, still is one of the safest, les than 30% victimizacion is considered quite safe.

Anyway there is a marked correlation between the population and victimizacion so, the less people come to Arica the safer will remain

Sorry if you take offense at my sharing my opinion and experience. Which is neither Holly or anecdotal. I thought that was the point of a forum. And I'm happy for your feeling safe in your home town. That's huge.
However, I've lived and traveled constantly in all of Chile in for 25 years. Take Stgo, Conce, Valpo out of the equation. You can throw out all the numbers you want, I know where I feel safe. I know when I'm at risk.
You guys have great waves by the way.
And I find the kettles blacker down south. I think its from cooking more over brasas.

Hello Seawolf180

SOrry if I was unpolite, it was not my intention. Of course avery one can feel safe or unsafe in a city, anyone can have their own opinion on a place there is nothing to argue on that. I just was trying to be informative with a source which I consider reliable (even many public policies are decided based in this survey) and I think that besides anyone´s personal opinion -absolutly valid- there are also research and figures which may be considered.

See, I am chilean, was born in Santiago and raised in one of the mos dangeorus areas (poblacion La Victoria, for those who know it) then at 15 I spent 4 years living in Chiloe and the last 36 years in Arica, with some 8 years living intermitent in Iquique. May I be wrong but I think that I know my people and the social changes in Chile, you know, to be local may help.

Well, I just posted because in my opinion the idea of high drug consuption or high crime in Arica is a factual error, I know the drugs issue very well and in the map of drug addicts big cieties as Santiago, COncepcion, Valparaiso, even Iquique are far higher than in Arica, or any medium to small city in Chile. I am not "defending the honor" of Arica (I don´t care such thing really) but trying to share my experience.backed with some research.

There are one statistic who mention a relatively high consuption of drugs between kids in Arica, I mean Encuesta Conace, but their methodology is -in my view- far to serious, based in "interviews" where kids usually answer kidding, the purpose of this survey is obtain public funds so is notoriously biased.

Which I think is out of discussion is the rate of crime, several national statistics mention Arica as one of the safest in Chile.

tombrad2 wrote:Hello Seawolf180

SOrry if I was unpolite, it was not my intention. Of course avery one can feel safe or unsafe in a city, anyone can have their own opinion on a place there is nothing to argue on that. I just was trying to be informative with a source which I consider reliable (even many public policies are decided based in this survey) and I think that besides anyone´s personal opinion -absolutly valid- there are also research and figures which may be considered.

See, I am chilean, was born in Santiago and raised in one of the mos dangeorus areas (poblacion La Victoria, for those who know it) then at 15 I spent 4 years living in Chiloe and the last 36 years in Arica, with some 8 years living intermitent in Iquique. May I be wrong but I think that I know my people and the social changes in Chile, you know, to be local may help.

Well, I just posted because in my opinion the idea of high drug consuption or high crime in Arica is a factual error, I know the drugs issue very well and in the map of drug addicts big cieties as Santiago, COncepcion, Valparaiso, even Iquique are far higher than in Arica, or any medium to small city in Chile. I am not "defending the honor" of Arica (I don´t care such thing really) but trying to share my experience.backed with some research.

There are one statistic who mention a relatively high consuption of drugs between kids in Arica, I mean Encuesta Conace, but their methodology is -in my view- far to serious, based in "interviews" where kids usually answer kidding, the purpose of this survey is obtain public funds so is notoriously biased.

Which I think is out of discussion is the rate of crime, several national statistics mention Arica as one of the safest in Chile.

You know your country well. And your points are all well taken. I must have had some shit luck, or made bad choices in Arica. I'm also pissed at whats been going on in Pichilemu during the summer lately. Out of control. And it's total excess of drugs and booze rooted. I have kids, I hate the influence of drugs on this society...its gotten worse. Not nearly as bad as some locals but defenitely worse.
Thanks.
Lago Chungara is one of the most beautiful places I've seen.

Ah Seawoolf, I think thar every one of us living in Chile are pissing with the way that crime has raised, I think -and is just my opinion again- that a series of permisive policies, starting with "Leyes Cumplido" in the early 90s has empowered criminals and turned crime in a safe and profitable activity, it seems it is a world trend and I hope it reverse soon
cheers!

I must have had some shit luck, or made bad choices in Arica. I'm also pissed at whats been going on in Pichilemu during the summer lately. Out of control. And it's total excess of drugs and booze rooted. I have kids, I hate the influence of drugs on this society...its gotten worse. Not nearly as bad as some locals but defenitely worse.

g~j think that first part is really accurate seawolf...
Just a matter of wrong place - wrong time...
This phenomenon happens quite a bit - then people tend to make inaccurate projections and generalizations, far beyond what might be the actual situation.
Another example of those fallacies and biases, that g~j have beaten around other posts.
It all gets down to perception of risk...
[we'll try to keep it short~simple here].
One of the hats g~ wore (for about 16 years) was in the field of "risk management"
This was not the financial side many might associate... but the physical side...
The stuff that will really hurt you and kill you.
Viewed as a professional, we can only say that the large majority of folks have very little understanding of where "risks" in their life really lie.
Hey... take a bunch of less-than-accurate views foisted by the fear-mongering media, then add a dose of hearsay and urban legend, plus a smattering of flawed interpretation based on less-than-critical thinking... mix it all into the risk~decision stew...
Whaddya get?
Unfortunately, many risk~decisions based on a flawed paradigm.
At the risk of boring some... it gets down to "paradigm paralysis" - which is akin to another animal called "confirmation bias".
Hey... g~ could wax poetic on this stuff for pages
But let's keep it in context...
If anybody makes some decision about "risks" - as to where to go or live in Chile (or anywhere)
Based on such demonstrably false paradigms... well, there are lots of grains of salt in that old shaker.
Most folks have no concept that it ain't the "drug addict" in Arica, or anywhere, that's gonna cause you harm...
Proviso... unless they are stupid enuff to walk out of a bar, half smashed, late at night, in the wrong part of town, flashing their cash and golden rings... and "ASK FOR IT"
It's the entirely mundane things that offer "risk" to people... time and time again.
Like not looking left and right before you cross the street and get hit by that big freak'n bus.
Case in point... the tragic accident recently in Santiago.
Hey... petty and opportunistic theft is one thing - this can happen anywhere, if a person is not "mindful" of the situation they are in.
g~j, over 13 years of traveling and living in some pretty rough~remote places, have been "victims" of such theft perhaps 3 or 4 time - mostly our own damn fault - and in the long run, pretty inconsequential.
Petty theft and property damage notwithstanding...
g~j defy ANYONE to show proof that any expat here in Chile has suffered injury or death from a "drug addict"
Here in Arica... or anywhere else.
Prove us wrong - if you can... then put it into a statistical analysis, and a broader geographic sample... for the BIGGER picture.

Whew... that was a long one... g~j now need a good dose of their evening drug of choice
Salud, allchileans