Chile Forum

eeuunikkeiexpat wrote:And before this gets into a debate, I lived in non-swanky Santiago Centro near Iglesia San Francisco for five years without becoming a statistic though many chilenos I talked to had been victims or know relatives or friends who have been victims in that Alameda-Ahumada-Estado-Santa Lucia general area.

That could have been because you were more aware of your surroundings as a foreigner. In the US, many states license individuals to carry concealed weapons. Part of that license includes training on "Cooper color codes." (You can google for it. It's interesting.). I believe police academies teach it too. The basic premise is that, if you're aware of your current risk level, you can more easily adjust to a higher risk level when something occurs to justify it. The benefit isn't so much the ability to react quickly, it's the preparedness that is projected to would-be bad guys. They tend to look for people who are planning today's activities, tonights bar hopping, etc. If someone looks like they're in the "now," bad guys tend to look for someone else.

I have personal experience with it. I will always believe I stopped an armed robbery at a grocery store in Tempe in 2000. He didn't even pull his gun. As he was getting ready to do his thing, he noticed I was fixed on him. Partciularly his hand under his shirt. We communicated visually for a few seconds, and he left.

So, it wouldn't surprise me if a foreigner tends to exhibit the "color code" behavior due to them being out of their element. Although, after a year or two, they might begin to fall into "the routine" and the mental laziness it leads to.

Mark

eeuunikkeiexpat wrote:He did say generalizations. I pass through Maipu on the highway on the bus trip between the coast and Santiago all the time and I do see the high fences (generally) and even multiple perimeter fencing on some of the stamped out housing developments.

Before this turns into a debate , I was only disputing Charles's depiction that the fences in Maipu were unusual. Not that they exist, or that there aren't any tall ones. He seemed to call it out as unique to Maipu. (I thought his reference to generalizations had to do with people being socially stuck there.). My impression was that the amount (and ruggedness) of fences didn't seem much different than what I'd seen elsewhere, further up O'Higgins. In Providencia, I've seen commercial buildings fenced and with barbed wire along the fence.

Maipu might look unusual because it seems to have more single-family residences. I believe Charles attested to this. That tends to create more opportunity for fencing than, say, apartment buildings. I haven't traveled around Chile much. I don't know how it compares nationwide. But, just my experience in Santiago, it seemed average. (I suspect Vitacura and Las Condes are different because residents have the luxury to pay for private security.).

Mark

eeuunikkeiexpat wrote:I lived in non-swanky Santiago Centro near Iglesia San Francisco for five years without becoming a statistic though many chilenos I talked to had been victims or know relatives or friends who have been victims in that Alameda-Ahumada-Estado-Santa Lucia general area.

While on the topic of street crime, does anyone formulate how they would respond if they were a victim? Give them what they want (maybe small bills kept in one pocket, throw it on the ground and run)? Resist? Carry an innocuous item which could be used as a weapon (bottle opener on a key ring?).

Just wonder how people anticipate dealing with something like this. Or, if they don't anticipate it (just hope it won't happen)?

Mark

hmmm Maipu I'm from Maipu, and my moms family have been living there since the late 60's early 70's so it's been a lifetime, I lived there for 12 years until I move to the states, yes there some bad places in Maipu. The interesting thing about Maipu is that on one side of the street there's the nice houses and on the other side of the street there's those government given apartments that are really unstable and I don't know how the stand earthquakes when kids run through the halls of the second and third floor the entire thing just SHAKES, where my grandma lives is in 4 Alamos about 2 miles from el templo Votivo de maipu is really nice. Nearby is the catholic school Carolina Llona de Cuevas which i attended for 7 years , and Mall plaza Oeste where I would go watch movies buy clothes and stuff with my bro, and grandma, and cousins aaa good memories

Ignite wrote:where my grandma lives is in 4 Alamos about 2 miles from el templo Votivo de maipu is really nice.

What area does your grandmother live? My wife's family is near Luis Gandarillas and El Sol. (If you've forgotten where that is, here's the map. Replace [dot] with .).

maps [dot] google [dot] com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=maipu+chile&ie=UTF8&ll=-33.505761,-70.749357&spn=0.0129,0.014591&z=16

Mark

loreleiah wrote:I thought it would be a fun and useful idea for the people who live in Chile to introduce the towns they live in; some pros and cons and anything in between.

This could be a great way for newbies to get a basic introduction to different cities in Chile virtually, for those of us who have not yet had the chance to get there.

How about it? Anyone?

Post any random facts about your town. Best bakery in town, nicest park, shadiest neighborhood?

I live in Temuco en pleno centro. That means right smack dab in the middle of "downtown". One thing is that the crime rate in Temuco is going up. I witnessed a robbery right in front of my apartment about 2 weeks ago. It's probably not a good idea to walk around by yourself at night say after 10:30pm. Anyways, I don't head out much, but if people are interested in the bar scene there are some interesting bars on Av. Alemania. One that I liked was called "Infame". A nice intimate atmosphere, but with a whole lot of smoke. I would say that the best bakery isn't Marriett!!!!! Even though everyone goes there. I go there sometimes as well. But I truly love El Creek, which is a great little cafe in front of the main Plaza on Claro Solar. A cute little cafe and not frequented by Temuquenses as much as Marriett.

I myself like to spend time outside of Temuco. I really like going on little trips to the countryside (el campo). I lived outside of Quepe going towards the coast for 3 months during the Summer. It is a great place to get away from the smog and people. I also like to go to Tolten, which is a small coastal town Southwest of Temuco. The southern coastal towns between Valdivia and Temuco make great day trips!

Well, here's the reference Mark asked for:

Sorry I believe I got that name wrong. Isla de Maipo is the wine production, colonial style town.

Maipú, is a notoriously low class area (bordering on ghetto) and one of the earliest track home hells built on the edge of Santiago.

topic1126.html?hilit=maipo

Damn, didn't find that post because I omitted searching Maipu with the accent.

Nothing beats the brutal honesty of a long-term self-sponsored expat.

OK, time for mandatory charm school and diplomatic training for us expats!!

Really, don't mess with an expat ...

eeuunikkeiexpat wrote:. . . . Nothing beats the brutal honesty of a long-term self-sponsored expat.

OK, time for mandatory charm school and diplomatic training for us expats!! . . . .

Wow, EE.UU., next you'll be honorary American consul somewhere on the coast . . . .

yes, I remember "La autopista del sol" and Rinconada, the my school address is "Carmen con San Jose" and I remember when I used to walk through la auto pista when it was being built back in 1999-2000. My aunt's departamento was near that you look out the window and you would see the thing

loreleiah wrote:Well, here's the reference Mark asked for:

Sorry I believe I got that name wrong. Isla de Maipo is the wine production, colonial style town.

Maipú, is a notoriously low class area (bordering on ghetto) and one of the earliest track home hells built on the edge of Santiago.

topic1126.html?hilit=maipo

Thanks. I disagree with that depiction. But, I agree with Charles's subsequent and more expressive description in this thread (although I disagree with the implication that the amount of fencing is unusual, per my response to him and EEUU.).

Maipu strikes me as middle-class (with some low-class areas due to government-subsidized affordable housing). It doesn't seem much different than a town like Riverside CA, or Mesa AZ. They have a mix (including Section 8 housing). Maipu seems different compared to the other Santiago communes (which may be more homogenous) because it existed as its own town. It was far enough out that it resembles other suburb towns (which developed differently over time). I wouldn't say Maipu is as nice as Riverside or Mesa. It's relative, right? Las Condes isn't as nice as Beverly Hills, Brentwood or Gross Pointe. Within Chile's scale, I'd compare Maipu to the average US suburb. (Older suburb with a history, not the instant, developer-inspired suburbs of recent past, like Mission Viejo CA).

That's just my impression.

Mark

loreleiah wrote:Well, here's the reference Mark asked for:

Sorry I believe I got that name wrong. Isla de Maipo is the wine production, colonial style town.

Maipú, is a notoriously low class area (bordering on ghetto) and one of the earliest track home hells built on the edge of Santiago.

topic1126.html?hilit=maipo

BTW: I have changed my avitar to reflect my attitude over Charles referring to Maipu as a "ghetto." An apology, and dog-from-h3ll goes away.

Mark

tombrad2 wrote:I think the problem is not the incomes but crime in Santiago has increased hugely due lax of represive crime laws

Tom, what's an example of this? When did the laxity start? (it sounds like it started at some point because you say crime increased). What is the laxity due to? (A liberal view that criminals are a product of society, therefore we have ourselves to blame for their condition? Or, not enough money to keep more people in prison longer?).

Mark

Well the stats show the increase though officials always claim "better reporting" is the main cause but the people know better.

As a 7 + year resident, 5 of those in Santiago, most of the recent upswing occurred after Bachelet was elected. The impression is she does not give a damn about the issue.

Chilean prisons are full and overcrowded and most petty criminal returned to the streets in a matter of hours or days. And now the idiots in gov just put marijuana in the same category as hard narcotic drugs.