Chile Forum

I must say I appreciate your candor.

As far as blaming a private for firing I think we can both agree that the fault would lie with his superiors. There were some who refused orders and were executed.

Now as far as Stalin? I am not a fan actually. So I will not pretend to defend him and I awknowledge the things he did as would I awknowledge what the Khmer Rouge did in Cambodia.

But the whole overhyped Chile was in a civil war storyline is overblown. Were there forces in the Allende government pushing for more drastic changes? Hell yeah..... I only wish that he had listened to those who advised him against picking Pinochet to head the army.

More to the point would be the the subject of this thread. I have said and will continue to say that nothing done in the Allende government justified what happened under Pinochet. Even if you say that the months following the coup were frantic and whatever, nothing can justify what Pinochet did in the years following. I refer to cases such as Rodrigo Rojas De Negri who was killed for what? Being a kid with a camera. That is for what.... Cause journalists in particular were targets. But what kinds of animals set two kids on fire? I would kindly ask that you name me one equivelant action done under Allende.

People would have everyone believe that everyone who Pinochet tortured, dissapeared, or killed was a radical Mirista or communist with a weapons cache in his bedroom. While there were some (Miguel Henriquez for one) more typical were the killings of los degollados. Nattino, Guerrero and Parada were a painter, a teacher/unionist, and a worker for the Vicaria de la Solidaridad. Victor Jara was a singer, theatre director and playwright. My dad was a teacher. My uncle was an architect. Most people killed under Pinochet were not terrorists. They were teachers, doctors, journalists (including Americans), priests and unionists. To be a union leader under Pinochet was to have a bullseye on your forehead.

I am not a Mirista. But Miguel Henriquez died fighting for what he believed in. If one applies the term terrorist to him for fighting a non elected dictatorship then I guess we better be willing to apply the same term to the French resistance during World War 2.

As far as Patagoniax, I bear him no ill will.... But when I read pro Franco sentiments then I guess I have to differ in opinion as did most of the world at the time. People from all over the world went to fight Franco. He was a fascist. Most Spaniards see his rule as a dark time in Spanish history.

As far as myself? Having lived in Canada all these years I have met dozens of chileans who were imprisoned, tortured, had relatives killed or dissapeared. And my province is small. I have had close personal friends who 'holidayed' in isla Dawson. I know many people from northern Chile who were jailed merely for belonging to the Socialist, and yes, communist parties. They were legal parties. When I visit Chile I constantly run ionto people who have had similar experiences. Must be the social circles I run around in. But I would highly suggest that if anyone wants a non touristy field trip that they visit londres 38. It is part of Chile. a not insignificant part of our history.


My father went to prison for 18 months. We lost our livelihood, my dad his career. When he was released we were sent packing. New country. New food. New language. And a nice job as a janitor in Canada. I got to watch my mom cry herself to sleep for the better part of a year cause her dad died in '78 and she could not attend the funeral. I got to finally see my grandmother in '88 for the first time when she came to visit only to watch her die from cancer two years later.

I lost uncles, aunts, grandparents, friends. My uncle Jorge like I said earlier ended up in East Germany. So I lost contact with him and my cousins from that side. Back in the '70s a phone call to Chile was like over 3 dollars a minute.... hour long conversations bonding with family were out of the question.

So like I told you earlier he married a woman named Michelle. While she was my aunt I never ever met her or even so much as talked to her on the phone. They moved back to Chile. They separated. She went on to become president. And man I gotta tell you, even though I have never even talked to her, I was happy.... It was like an Up Yours to every motherfuc^%$er that ever backed the coup. And when she left office her approval ratings were through the roof. And you can't take that away or change it.... What also cannot be changed is that her father was tortured. And he was no communist. And she and her mother were detained..... Takes real men to imprison, rape, and torture women as was done under Pinochet.

I have family in Maipu, Nunoa, and in the nicer parts of Santiago. I know people from all stratas.... I know Pinochet lovers and Pinochet haters.... But I have yet to have any of them deny that what happened happened. One cannot rewrite history cause it inconveniences oneself.

xxx

Exactly my sentiments..... It is too complex a topic and best just left for an hour long discussion over beers.... Like I said I am just here to learn a few tips and tricks.... All the best....